PeteB Posted June 28, 2011 Share Posted June 28, 2011 I have some rye spirit at 57% ABV that I wish to put into barrels. Around 62% is the highest that is normally put into wood, but I have no information about a normal lower limit. I have been doing late cuts (pot still) because I find it gives a better taste and smell for "white dog". I hope 57% is high enough as I would rather not redistill., any information would be appreciated. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul Tomaszewski Posted June 29, 2011 Share Posted June 29, 2011 you should be good to barrel. We distill our "whiskey mashes" at around 105 proof and then it goes straight to the barrel. Back in the day, everything was barreled at a lower proof. IMHO, as long as you pay attention to your heads and tails, lower proof means more flavor. If you like the flavor from what you're mashing, than that should be a good thing, especially if you want to set yourself apart and accentuate whatever it is instead of "just another rye." I will say that by barreling your whiskey at a lower proof, in our experience, it tends to age somewhat slower. Again, a trade off for flavor. We age our 5-gal barrels for a year, give or take, just for reference. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeteB Posted June 29, 2011 Author Share Posted June 29, 2011 Thanks for that Paul. This batch is actually 58% ie 116 Proof so it is well within range. I am putting this lot into 50 Litre (13 gall) reused, recharred barrels. Will have to wait 2 years by Australian law to call it Whisky. I wonder if I could get away with less than 2 years and call it whiskEy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jonathan Forester Posted July 1, 2011 Share Posted July 1, 2011 Pete- That small a barrel, recharred, for two years is a long time. It may get way overwooded. Thanks for that Paul. This batch is actually 58% ie 116 Proof so it is well within range. I am putting this lot into 50 Litre (13 gall) reused, recharred barrels. Will have to wait 2 years by Australian law to call it Whisky. I wonder if I could get away with less than 2 years and call it whiskEy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeteB Posted July 2, 2011 Author Share Posted July 2, 2011 Thanks for the tip. The small barrels have been used at least twice before so hopefully there is not too much "wood" left. I will monitor the progress and put into larger barrels if it becomes a problem. Another distillery I worked at was using 20 L (5 gall) and on approaching the 2 years they were concerned the wood would take over so they transferred to larger barrels and ended up with a fantastic "scotch" after just 2 years. Incredibly smoothe to my palate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Posted August 14, 2011 Share Posted August 14, 2011 From: AJEV The 1994 James F. Guymon Lecture Maturation of Wines and Spirits: Comparisons, Facts, and Hypotheses VERNON L. SINGLETON* Ethanol concentration effect on extraction: Maximum solids extraction from oak is obtained at 55% ethanol and close to that is traditional barreling proof for spirit maturation (121). Today, to make lighter products and use fewer barrels, spirits may be barreled down at higher proofs, but less total extraction results under otherwise similar circumstances. Pre-extraction with water depleted following ethanol extraction (29.3 g/kg versus untreated 56.1 g/kg) of solids from American oak, but the maximum extraction remained at 55%. Solids extraction from oak heartwood versus ethanol concentration and pre-extraction with water as percent of the 55% ethanol value taken as 100. Each point an average of five samples at each alcohol level over one to 16 days (121). (Fig. 4) (121). The substances extracted are shifted from water solubles such as sugars to poorly water-soluble components like lignin. Several other studies show similar effects regardless of wood source. With European oak, extraction was maximal at 45% ethanol and increased from pH 4 to pH 6 (125). Barrel reuse raised the maximal extraction to 55% ethanol as more lignin was extracted. At 55% brandy quality was considered better and was described as "vanillin-floral" whereas at lower alcohol "oaken" was the descriptor. At 10°C the brandy retained a raw flavor and six months at 50°C produced a strange "rummy" flavor. Whiskey aged eight years in new charred American oak was judged normally flavored at 59% alcohol, less mature at 63% ethanol, and weaker and different with a "spicy, green oak" taste at 77% ethanol (10). Wine, of course, is only 10% to 18% alcohol and would extract considerably differently than spirits, emphasizing the more water-soluble components. 121. Singleton, V. L., and D. E. Draper. Wood chips and wine treatment; the nature of aqueous alcohol extracts. Am. J. Enol. Vitic. 12:152-158 (1961). just one guys opinion.......so ~57% or so....but other comments on over-oaking should be considered since Tasmania has the 2ye restriction. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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