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Electric Boiler


kleclerc77

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Hey all,

We are currently in the market for a boiler. I was excited to hear that the 250 gallon still we are getting in can be run off of a 50kw electric boiler, as opposed to the monstrous gas fired boilers I've used in the past. I am having a hard time getting answers on pricing from the companies I have contacted. Does anyone in here have a ballpark estimate for the pricing of such a piece of equipment, and how much they paid to have it plumbed in? Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated, thanks!!

 

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Any reason why you would want to go electric instead of gas fired?  My 150g runs off 27kw and waiting two hours for it to heat up once or twice a day is a real bear.  Electric was cheaper to start off, but these $500-700 monthly electric bills are starting to add up and will eventually cost more to run than switching everything over to steam.

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An electric fired steam boiler like a Sussman or Reimers will probably be as costly to install and plumb as a gas fired boiler.  

In the case you might find it to be somewhat cheaper on the install, it's going to be a wash when you factor the increased operating costs.

Itll be similarly sized when installed, and the same rules apply to steam boilers regardless of how they fire.

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not sure if this is relevant but we have a electric boiler that heats our hydronic water system have never ran it to produce steam but have used it to produce 200 degree water . at over a 1000 bucks a month to run it was shut off in no time , our power bills come in every 3 months so by time we got the power bill it was not good , almost a big brown splatter on the post office wall when i opened the bill , my opinion is dont use electricity do what you have to to avoid it burn the neighbours furniture to produce heat if you have to anything but electricity . lol

tim   

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Next year, I will have a chiller to make 190F water with a new refrigerant coming on board.

Right now, I can offer a chiller with a tap to plumb to a heat exchanger/water heater. 

These are concepts to either replace or reduce the size of a boiler whether gas or electric.

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I run a 250g still off a 16hp boiler, so that's roughly 150kw in electrical equivalent.  I can heat up in about an hour if it's warmer temps, the equipment is still hot, etc.  Or about an hour and a half from a cold start in a winter.  The efficiency on the electric boiler should be somewhat higher, but I would imagine you are still looking at 3 hour heat up times with only 50kw.

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Thanks for all the input! I was steered towards an electric boiler by the company supplying our still. We have a small(er) facility and from what I understood, there are different rules for gas fired vs. electric boilers. Those rules being explosion proof rooms and general proximity to other equipment. I was told that you could put an electric boiler pretty much anywhere, while a gas fired boiler has to be much more isolated and must adhere to a laundry list of other regulations for it. Is this not the case? I was also told the warm up time shouldn't be any longer than a gas fired boiler. So much contradicting info! I will take all of this into account, thanks again for the advice everyone!

17 hours ago, Silk City Distillers said:

An electric fired steam boiler like a Sussman or Reimers will probably be as costly to install and plumb as a gas fired boiler.  

In the case you might find it to be somewhat cheaper on the install, it's going to be a wash when you factor the increased operating costs.

Itll be similarly sized when installed, and the same rules apply to steam boilers regardless of how they fire.

 

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2 minutes ago, kleclerc77 said:

We have a small(er) facility and from what I understood, there are different rules for gas fired vs. electric boilers. Those rules being explosion proof rooms and general proximity to other equipment. I was told that you could put an electric boiler pretty much anywhere, while a gas fired boiler has to be much more isolated and must adhere to a laundry list of other regulations for it. Is this not the case?

 

This is not the case, a boiler is a boiler.

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I don't know who is selling you the still (Corson?), but I believe that they are giving you incorrect info. From my experiance Silk City is correct "a boiler is a boiler".  If you want to go electric without all of the hassle or aditional cost of a boiler and if you have not already made your down payment for the still, we can sell you a jacketed 250 gallon still with a built in electric heating system.  Our built in electric heating system is a little more efficiant than an electrically fired boiler, becouse you do not have the heat loss that boiler plumbing has, however a natural gas boiler will save you around $5.00 to $8.00 per run on that size still, depending on how much your electric costs per kw.    We also sell Rite propane and natural gas fired low pressure steam boilers, if you are interested.  paul@distillery-equipment.com 417-778-6100

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Yeah, I dont understand the thought process on getting an electric boiler to create steam to then heat your still.  If your going to use electric as your energy input (instead of natural gas) why pay more for a steam heated still, and more for a steam boiler.  Either go electric still (with element, or a bain marie) and have the cheaper/easier install/up front cost, or go natural gas with a boiler an pay more up-front for the lower operating cost.  Getting a steam heated still with an electric fired boiler kinda seems like getting the worst of both (typically more expensive still, more to pipe and install, boiler to install, potentially needing a boiler room, high operating costs).

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The only reason I can understand going electric fired boiler is that you don't have to buy each piece of equipment as electric, which in itself saves a ton of money.  If I purchased 3 electric stills and an electric mash tun, I'd need 4 control panels (which are not cheap) to run them, plus the cost of electric heated stills is typically greater than a steam jacket, and your options for electric stills/tuns are pretty limited as well.

I'm just confused as to why not go natural gas.  If it's simply not available, or ridiculously expensive I can understand that totally.

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On 6/22/2017 at 7:51 PM, MG Thermal Consulting said:

Next year, I will have a chiller to make 190F water with a new refrigerant coming on board.

Right now, I can offer a chiller with a tap to plumb to a heat exchanger/water heater. 

These are concepts to either replace or reduce the size of a boiler whether gas or electric.

That's very interesting Mike.  Tell us more!

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In a nutshell, I went to a meeting about a large heat recovery project which at present the refrigerant used will allow near 170F on the water side used for heating a building to replace a hot water boiler. The compressor manufacturer is now testing a refrigerant that will allow 190F water to be supplied. Testing is progressing to where the refrigerant will get the OK by next year to be used.

The chiller used for this would look like a typical water cooled modular chiller, the chilled water side would be used for the distillery equipment cooling loop and the hot water side would be used for the hot water.  In the case where heating water is not needed, we would use an additional outdoor aircooler to reject heat not needed. The chiller itself would be higher in HP but the efficiency of the refrigeration cycle is higher than either steam or direct electric heat, so initial cost would be greater for the heat recovery system, but overall consumption would be less and paybacks are usually calculated to be five years or less.

The only way we can reclaim hot water off the chiller directly at present is to use a hot refrigerant to water plate exchanger, which can be used with todays chillers as an option.  

If you or anyone else is considering a design around heat recovery to seriously reduce the size of boiler or replacement to heat reclaim hot water, I can budget fairly closely with your distillery designer for a long term project or a heat recovery add-on to your present system.

Contact me directly if you would like to be placed on a list for future notifications of heat recovery options.

 

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Cool!  (pun intended)

I don't have anything short term, but it's good to know this is an option down the road.  I could see a system where you have a 190F hot liquor tank, suitably sized so you can use it to preheat a wash from 75F to say 140F+ as you load the still.  This is, of course, in addition to using the hot water for mashing.

As a mechanical engineer, I certainly can appreciate the efficieny of this type of setup over spending money to heat and cool separately.  Reminds me of my uncle who had a swimming pool heater that was run on the home's air conditioner's waste heat.

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Devil's in the details (like sizing HLT and trim cooler for excess heat)- a lot has to be known to accurately price out a complete system, but like you say, it's good to know what's out there for the future!

In your example, it would seriously reduce boiler size ( I have those to supply as well).  

In your example, we can do this with current technology and swap out refrigerants when the new refrigerant is available- just in case someone doesn't want to wait:)

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