Custom Designed Copper Pot Concerns

[Dark Corner]

My name is Joe Fenten and I am the co-founder of Dark Corner Distillery. After speaking with Bill Owens last week about my still design I thought it may be best to post my concerns in this forum. I designed a custom 80 gallon copper pot still (see picture below) and had a friend of the family fabricate it locally. I designed it in the tradition of the Dark Corner moonshine stills that were used in the Blue Ridge Mountains.

I have attached a photograph of our still. Notice that I had the lyne arm flanged. This is so that I can place an elbow between the flanges and vary the lyne arm angle if need be. The arm starts out at 4" in diameter and tapers down to 1/2". You cannot see it in the picture but we also have a thumper keg(oak barrel) that the lyne arm dumps steam into. Out of the thumper we go into a 1/2" copper worm coil. We were hoping to achieve 100 proof in one run as long as the thumper was full of low wines.

Bill explained to me that the thumper will be more of a headache than anything with all the cleaning that is required. He also mentioned that it will NOT provide a large increase in proof as we had hoped. With that said I am looking into the idea of removing the thumper and using a dephlegmator (partial condenser) and/or copper packing to get a higher proof in one run. I will not know our actual proof until we do our first run in July.

I am now thinking about dephlegmator designs that are compatible with my still. I cannot remove the head but can access the head through the manway and through the lyne arm flange if modifications are needed. I have some ideas of my own but would love some input from you guys on what I can do to get the proof up on my runs. What proof do you think I can I achieve with a dephlegmator and packing in one run? Should I get rid of the thumper keg altogether? Anyone have a dephlegmator design that may work with my still?

I appreciate all your time and help.

Cheers!

Joe Fenten

Dark Corner Distillery

[will]

Joe,

My vote is: don't do anything until you run it at least once. If you're going for "authentic" then stick with authentic.

A dephlegmator and packing will allow you to achieve a higher proof on a single pass, but with the shape of your still's head, you'll probably find that reflux is quite imperfect. Without packing, condensate will drip back to the kettle, and that simply wastes time.

A thumper is a special case of a plate. Although I have no direct experience with a thumper, first, I would trust the writings of the old farts, second, I would expect that if the thumper is sized and filled to match the size of the power plant, then you'll get exactly what you're looking for...good 'shine.

Will your state allow you to pour tastes? How about sell small quantities to retail customers? If yes on either, with your location and foot traffic, you should have plenty of fun.

Good luck,

Will

[JohninWV]

I don't know as much about designing stills as some of these other guys, but you should have a great location for growing a business. Greenville is a great town and your location and story should be rock solid. I'd love to come visit sometime when I'm closer (I travel to Charlotte often). Good luck. Let me know if you need any help.

Best,

John Little

Smooth Ambler Spirits

[Dark Corner]

Joe,

My vote is: don't do anything until you run it at least once. If you're going for "authentic" then stick with authentic.

A dephlegmator and packing will allow you to achieve a higher proof on a single pass, but with the shape of your still's head, you'll probably find that reflux is quite imperfect. Without packing, condensate will drip back to the kettle, and that simply wastes time.

A thumper is a special case of a plate. Although I have no direct experience with a thumper, first, I would trust the writings of the old farts, second, I would expect that if the thumper is sized and filled to match the size of the power plant, then you'll get exactly what you're looking for...good 'shine.

Will your state allow you to pour tastes? How about sell small quantities to retail customers? If yes on either, with your location and foot traffic, you should have plenty of fun.

Good luck,

Will

Will, thanks so much for the comments. I will read what others have to say and see if anyone has additional input.

[Absinthe Pete]

As will said wait until you run the still first. But, my observation is that your 1/2" taper at the end of the lyne arm and 1/2" worm might be a problem. I see it choking at that point.

A couple of questions, how much heat are you running(either BTUs or Watts will be fine for an answer) and will you be distilling with the mash in the pot?

[Paul Tomaszewski]

I'm not a professional still maker/designer, but our simple 100-gal. copper pot still distills our hearts to somewhere in the 100-115 proof range on one pass (that's the combined hearts average). All that's connected to ours is a very simple condenser but, other than that, our kettle/lyne arm have nothing inside whatsoever. You can check out a pic on our website (www.mbrdistillery.com), and I'd take Will's recommendation. Just some side advice that I'd mentally prepare myself (if you haven't already) that you'll need to tweak some things in your first few months of operation until you get into a comfortable groove, so don't be afraid to be ready to run it one way and have a back-up plan or two to run it a different way, especially if you have a few extra bucks to run things that way.

[JohninWV]

I think Paul makes a great comment. Even guys like us using a Carl (or Vendome, etc) need to be prepared to completely change every procedure to see how it changes the product. That's supposed to be why we have plates that can be closed or opened, dephalgmators, etc.

[will]

Joe,

Just reflecting on what my good friend Absinthe Pete has observed from the picture. You can't run raw mash, only strained beer, because your fill and dump valves are too small. That's fine, but you'll probably change that in the first days of use. There's no reason to waste time fillin' and dumpin'.

On the subject of the lyne arm, if the hose is 1/2 inch, then you have to get down to that at some point, and 1/2 inch should be okay for a still of that size, especially if it's blowing into a thump keg. If your kettle does not contain chunks, then you can't puke hard enough with a hat like that to do any damage...but that's why the old boys used rye batter to seal-up their stills - if they had a problem, it would just take itself apart gently.

Your still looks great, I really like it. Don't change it just because some old guy with a grey flat-top thinks thumpers are a pain in the ass. I'll bet him $50 that you'll like it just fine. It's going to be a money-maker.

Good luck,

Will

[PeteB]

Jo, I can't make any comments about thumpers, I have read the theory but have no experience.

What I would like to ask is how does Paul's "copper pot still distills our hearts to somewhere in the 100-115 proof range on one pass (that's the combined hearts average)"

In the theory that I have read if your wash is at 9% you will get 100% proof and quickly drop from there as the alcohol in wash reduces. And in practice that is roughly what happens in my pot still. You must be starting at a very high wash %, or am I misunderstanding something?