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Southernhighlander

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Everything posted by Southernhighlander

  1. Silk City, Thank you very much for taking the time to help. I will pass this along to my customer. I learned a lot from your info myself. Jeffw, I will pass your info along as well. Thank you.
  2. No, there is nothing to prevent you from using water for future mashing. You will need to get any oil cleaned out well if yuo have been using it with oil,. If you go back to oil you will need to be extra careful to get all of the oil out. Email me privately if you need instructions for getting all of the oil out.
  3. Okay everybody. Please see the below and thanks again for the help. Also, see the pic below. My Customer thinks that the problem is a wild yeast called Kahm yeast. Paul, Here is our current process for making bourbon whiskey. Just FYI, I’ve experimented with just about every aspect of this process trying to eliminate the cause of our skunky flavor. Also another FYI, I brought a sample of this “skunk” out to Rusty, and his opinion seemed to coincide with what you mentioned earlier about heads bleeding through the run. Rusty thought that our skunky sample had some characteristics of heads, although the sample was taken about 1 hour after I cut the heads off in the run. I’m generally getting about 10% heads to the expected overall yield per run. Once it seems the heads are about done, I do notice a definite (expected) change in flavor and temperature in the still, but the change goes directly into this super skunky flavor. I don’t monitor the proof of the heads so when I make the cut I’m generally running a little cold in the dephlegmator so I’m a little high in proof at the start of the hearts cut. It seems like this skunk is more prominent at higher proofs, until I make adjustments to the dephlegmator temperature to knock the proof down to about 140 where the flavor seems to be the most tolerable. From what I could tell at Rusty’s, it seems like our mash is getting scorched in the still, which I think would probably have a major effect on flavor. Also, seems like too high of a temperature could have all the cuts bleeding together as well. I haven’t had a chance yet to experiment with alternate heating times and methods. I’ll be distilling early next week. So basically we have 3 major issues: Kahm yeast in the fermenter if left to open air for any length of time. – Resorted to covering fermenter tanks with clear plastic shrink wrap. No wild yeast at all when covering fermenters. Problem solved? Idk Stuck fermentation- At first I thought the wild yeast and the stuck fermentations were related. I’ve eliminated the wild yeast but still have fermentations stop at 4-5 Brix. Ferment still looks, smells and tastes great though. “Skunky” Flavor in distillate- Super sour, astringent, skunky, medicinal, and also metallic flavor in distillate especially at higher proofs. Sometimes the skunk works it’s way out once we settle into a lower proof, sometimes it stays through the whole run Cleaning: I’m always paranoid about mold/bacteria/infections so I make every effort possible to clean all equipment the best I can. I’ve use cleaners such as sodium percarbonate, PBW, citric acid, vinegar, etc.. I also sanitize after rinsing with Star San. I’ve also experimented with NOT using these chemicals just to see if that made a difference in bacterial/mold growth or flavor. The result is always the same- if I cover my fermenters no abnormal growth happens. If I leave my fermenters open for any length of time I get what I’ve come to find out is Kahm Yeast. Pic included. I’ve experimented with taking the entire column apart and all the plates apart and cleaning all parts with brushes and Q-tips. Even had them soaking overnight in vinegar. I’ve also experimented with just rinsing the column with hot water after a run just to see if the cleaners were causing any problems. Same results, clean or dirty. Cooking: Using RO water. City water here is terrible. Pot temp to about 120 F Add 2 of 3 enzymes, then corn and rye then let rest for 30 mins Ramp up to 150 F, add number 3 enzyme, add barley, let rest for 90 mins Ramp up to 175 F, let rest for 90 mins Cool to 80-85 F, add Fermaid K (1 g/gal- had trouble with stuck fermentation earlier then tried this Fermaid K and seemed to work for a few fermentations) Add Yeast (Red Star Distillers active dry, also experimented with 2 other brands of active dry yeast with same results) Brix reading with Brix hydrometer: 19 (I’ve experimented with all different ways of cooking as well with the same result of 19 brix) Mash PH is around 5.5- 5.8 Fermentation: Mash goes in at 80-85 F (Fermenting on-grain) Cover fermenter tank with clear “pallet wrap” plastic Everything seems very active, smells and looks great, a cake develops within a few hours Ferment temp gets to around 90 F Cake remains for about 3-4 days Check Brix on 5th day Distill on 5th or 6th day (when we’ve had successful fermentations they usually took 5-6 days) Final PH on Ferment is around 3.8 Distilling: Distilling on-grain Heat still to a vapor temp below column (4 plate copper) to about 200 F Let column reflux for about 30 mins with full dephlegmator flow Cut flow to dephlegmator to allow a nice steady stream (column head usually goes straight for 174 F, don’t know if that’s a coincidence or not. Can’t get anything to flow below that temp) After 10% of expected total yield, the heads start to change over At this point I make the cut and observe my parrot hydrometer Adjust the dephlegmator flow to achieve at least below 160 Find “sweet spot” for flavor at particular proof, usually around 140 Let run to 110 or until taste is too “tailsy” (which has happened before 110 before) If I missed something, or if you need more details on something please let me know. Thanks Paul.
  4. Rotary lobe pumps are great pumps and they will do both, but they are really expensive. However as Silk City says "you will enjoy decades of flawless performance". Rotory lobe pumps are really incredible, they will pump cherries without breaking them. If anyone needs a quote on a rotary lobe pump. 417-778-6100 paul@distillery-equipment.com
  5. Sailer, SCD and Michael are correct, you certainly do not want to have aluminum wetted parts. Also with AODD pumps you not only have the cost of the pump, you also have the cost of the air compressor to run the pump. AODD pumps with 1.5" ports will use a lot of air. The graco 1040 saniforce that we sell can use up to 50 cfm of air. A 50 CFM compressor will cost between $3,800 to $5,000 and they will be 3 phase. I suggest one of our Jabsco flexible impeller pumps. It is self priming reversable and it has veriable pumping speeds of up to 20 gpm. It is also on a cart. https://shop.distillery-equipment.com/collections/brewing-distilling-equipment-accessories/products/20-gpm-jabsco-flexible-impeller-pump
  6. Just an addendum to what Silk City wrote. Centrifugal pumps work well for both CIP and moving wash, however Centrifugal pumps do not work well for grain in mashes. Flexible impeller pumps work well for grain in mashes but they do not work well for CIP.
  7. Has anyone heard of Kahm yeast? I'm wondering if it might be the culprit.
  8. Hi Adam, Sorry for the BS. They will be sending me a complete discription of their process by the end of the day and I will post it. I know that he said that they are starting with a brix of 19 and ending with a brix of 4.
  9. I am here to offer people the equipment that they need. I have helped a huge number of people on here with their equipment needs and I will continue to do that. Me disagreeing with you, did not mean that I had a negative attitude toward you, it just meant that I disagreed. You said that I made a snide remark, and I asked you to show it to me and you could not because I did not make any snide remark. I only disagreed with you. As far as distilling from corn my family has distilled from corn for well over 200 years My grandfathers distilled from malted corn for over 60 years. How long have you been distilling from corn? If I didn't know how to distill I wouldn't be in this business. I help my customers with their distilling processes everyday. But that doesn't mean that I know everything, there is always more to learn. I have learned a tun of stuff on here, especially from Silk City and also from Roger and many others and I will keep doing so.. I have a great deal of respect for Roger. He takes a lot of pride in what he does and he is all about craft and keeping craft pure. Also he does everything from scratch when many others are rebubling. I know that you use bulk spirits. That's fine in my opinion as long as you are not putting craft on the bottle. Do you put craft on the bottles of spirits that come from the bulk GNS that you buy? If you are doing so then you are misleading your customers. If you don't then I respect that.
  10. Below are a couple of our Vacuum stills that are used to reclaim ethanol from plant oil extraction. The top one is a 15 gallon and the lower one is a 150 gallon. We have sold vacuum stills large enough to process 800lbs of plant material per day.
  11. MGL, As far as my customers go I am absolutely loyal to them and I always take care of their needs. I only disagreed with Roger. I never disrespected him. Please see the below to see what my customers say about me. I have never had a customer give me a negative review that I know of and I have a lot of customers in this industry and I gain more every day.
  12. MGL, Show me a snide remark. You should reread what I wrote. I never made any snide remarks. Now read what you yourself wrote. I only disagreed with you. I appreciate the help but not the abuse. I will not retaliate in kind. Thank you.
  13. They didn't mention anything about mold in the corn but I will ask them. Thanks.
  14. They do have an agitator that mixes really well using very large paddles and slow RPMs. However, they said that they had a slightly scorched/smokey flavor. I asked them if there was any sticking to the inside of the pot and they said no. They were actually thinking that scorching was the problem but that is not really possible because I have never had that in any of the over 130 Baine maries that I have out there, except for 2 that were running 350 F oil in the jackets, who were not liquefying their corn mash. Those 2 had sticking of the corn mash to the sides and bottom of the inner boiler. Once they started liquefying their mash, they had no more sticking and no more smokey or burned flavors. I think that AK2 and Silk City are correct. Their assumptions make the most sense to me.
  15. Silk City, That all makes good sense. I will email them and see if they will email me a run down of their complete process and then I will post it here.
  16. No absolutely not. I've never seen anyone put antibiotics in their corn mash. My grandfather certainly never did. He never needed to. Open top fermentation of corn mash has been done for hundreds of years and antibiotics have only been around for less than 80 years. Most of my customers do corn and except for just a few who came out of the brewing industry, almost all of them use open top fermenters and I don't think any of them use antibiotics because they don't need to. I certainly never used any with my open top fermentations and I have never had an infection in my fermentations.
  17. adam, I think that you may be on to something with the sugars. This customer said that his distillate had a slightly scorched or Smokey flavor which is really weird because it is a baine marie still. I will let you know if this turns out to be the problem.
  18. I will let them know, what you said. Most craft distilleries doing corn, do open top fermentation. Most that do barley based mashes and wine do closed fermentations. I have never seen a corn mash turn to vinegar because of fruit flies or anything else for that matter. I have sold hundreds of open top corn fermenters to distilleries all over the US. Open top fermentation is the best way to go with on the grain corn fermentation, which is why many of the big Bourbon distilleries do it that way. Having the top open lets the heat out so you use less cooling energy. I have toured Bourbon Distilleries that have you stick your fingers in the mash and taste. At Jim Beam the tour guide had us stick our faces over their huge fermenters so that we got the CO2 in our faces. It;s just the traditional way that it is done her in the Southeastern US.. It is the way that my father, grandfather and great grandfather did it. If you are worried about stuff falling in the mash all you need to do is put a screen over the tun. The screen should be made from stainless screan and wooden slats.
  19. I have a customer who is having a problem. I think that he has some kind of infection in his mash. They are doing a grain in corn mash for Whiskey. The problem is that their distillate has a very skunky smell and taste. They have tried distilling very slowly and leaving the tails in the pot. Also their mash has a dark color after distillation. They say the mash does not have anything unusual about it when it leaves the fermenter but one thing that is very strange is the fact that if they try to ferment with the top open on the fermenter, the fermentation stops, no matter what point the fermantation is at. They can only get their mash to ferment when they have a lid on the fermenter. They say that they clean everything very well. I think that they have some kind of infection. Anyone have any ideas concerning what they can do to solve this issue?
  20. We have self priming centrifugal CIP pumps. We can also fabricate a CIP valve manifold for the pumps. We have oprions for carts, veriable speed and reversing capabilities. Give us a call or email 417-778-6100 paul@distillery-equipment.com
  21. We charge less for the same pump, plus I think that our hose costs less as well. https://shop.distillery-equipment.com/collections/brewing-distilling-equipment-accessories/products/5-gpm-explosion-proof-beverage-alcohol-pump-for-high-proof-spirits-flojet-g70c
  22. prcdc, If you email susan@distillery-equipment.com she will quote you for some hose for your flojet.
  23. jb, Your question is a very good one. I think that water uses less electricity because it has a better heat transfer coefficient. We will collect some data on that during this weeks testing and I will let you know for sure.
  24. bluestar, You can run proportional power control using our newer controllers as well as set point temp control so you can do it either way with water. Also water in the jacket has several advantages when it comes to cooking mash. You can heat with the jacket and steam inject from it at the same time. Also you can use water in the jacket to crash cool, also water is less likely to cause sticking or scorching, however we have only had 2 customer complaints concerning scorching and in both cases they were not liqifieing their mash. Once they started to liqify their corn mash the sticking and light scorching stopped. Of course one of the biggest reasons that I like water in the jacket is because it is non flammable. With all of the baine marie stills we have out there now, I worry about safety issues which is one of the main reasons that we are starting to push water and our new vacuum stills.
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