Penrock Distillery

Its going to be a while before I can look at doing a single malt as I have a fair bit of "bourbon" to make once I have my rum ran for some cash flow. I'm thinking ahead with this post. I will report back once I start the R&D. Perhaps you can do the same ? Regards Sim

Thanks for the reply !! I cut my teeth in a craft TN whiskey distillery in Nashville before moving back home to England so I'm aware that the US distilleries can do things a bit differently as not bound by tradition like the Scottish guys, which is why I asked the question here 🙂 I'm looking for as much flavour as I can get in my spirits and was leaning in that direction, perhaps going "grain in" is the way I should go since being in England, I'm also not bound by Scotch tradition either. I was just concerned there could be a negative affect. Cheers Sim

Hi All I'm thinking of making a malt whiskey. Since I'm in England and not Scotland I'm not bound by tradition and can blaze my own trail. My question is what are the advantages and disadvantages of fermenting and distilling on and off the grain with regards to the final spirit ? Cheers Sim !

Dmacnz. What machine do you guys have please ?

Hi All I'm in a bit of a dilemma here ! I'm a new start up distillery and I'm now a the point of bottling and labeling my products. I bought a pallet of Saverglass Mixolagest 50cl bottles and have got my labels designed and printed. Labels are printed on a clear acetate and are a 90% wrap on the bottle. I already have a Race Label Jr machine which I mistakenly thought would handle a slightly tapered bottle, but apparently not. I tried to adapt my machine to that of the taper capable Race Labeling machine but cant get that to work without creases and bubbles. Can anyone PLEASE recommend a machine that may be able to handle my needs? Would a proper taper capable Race Labeling machine do the job? Kind regards Sim Daley (AKA Pop Larkin) Penrock Distillery LTD

!! WoW !! Thanks for the reply's guys !!!!

Just curious what yeast you might me using for your bourbon ? Ive heard everything from DADY to bakers yeast, but just wondering what other options are being used out there without getting to technical? Regards Sim

Hi Glenlyon Could you please give a quick overview of how you harvest your yeast from one batch to the next? Regards Sim

So considering the above, how is it possible for a craft distillery to employ a sour mash process in their whiskey production? The only way I can see that might work, at least for me with the water that I have at my disposal, is to add the percentage of back-set to the cooker with the remaining volume of the mash water. Adjust the PH as you cook the corn so that when you pump into the fermenter the PH is at such a level that will promotes yeast health? I'm also assuming the back-set needs to be screened before being added back to prevent an increasing accumulation of solids in your mash? Any help would be very much appreciated as it's going my head in trying to sort the fact from the hype

Hello again. Now that I'm on the brink of stating my distillery, I've been really trying to get my head round the "sour mash" method of corn whiskey (bourbon) production. Research has produced contradictory results if I'm to believe what I'm told about ideal yeast environment. My initial understanding of the process was that you take a percentage of spent stillage (slop or back-set) from the still (10 - 25%) and add it to the next ferment. The rational bring that the acidic back-set lowers the mash PH to a level that promotes a healthy yeast environment . But my experiments is that back - set is very acidic, sitting around 3.2 - 3.4 PH so would lower the PH to well below the level yeast are said to thrive in. So considering the pioneers of sour mashing apparently used up to 100% back-set in there ferments, how ever did their yeast survive? Was the lowered PH of the mash intended to produce an environment so that when the mash was left left to accrue natural yeast strains, only the strongest would survive in such an environment thus providing as strong of a ferment as was achievable before monitoring technology existed? Perhaps the waters are getting muddied in these modern times with the big producers dictating how the method is said to work? Dare I say it might be mostly a marketing angle for them when in truth they simply employing the sour mash method to save on water consumption and reclaiming heat to cook the next batch of mash, only benefiting for the increased flavour profile as a bi-product of cost savings ?

Thank you everyone !! I have been kicking the idea of branding for my own product around for a lot of years now. When I lived in Nashville Id go to the big liquor stores and photograph the "craft" section to get an idea of what stands out as you surgest. I have been playing with a design myself but , as with everything I do, I'm not 100% happy with it. Its simple and elegant so ticks all the criteria you suggest, but I just doubt myself and that's the reason I was wanting to approach a designer. Maybe I can get a professional opinion on what I already have started. once again, many thanks for the input. Very much appreciate the help Sim

Brilliant !! Thanks Jedd. That's exactly what I was hoping to find. As you state in paragraph 2., I don't want to be and amateur nightmare to work with. Thanks a million !

Hi All I'm starting a very small rum and whiskey distillery is South West England and Ive finally reached the stage where I need to get a label design for my products. As I have zero idea about the process of getting a label designed, I was wondering if there was anyone out there that has been through the process and could give me some advice as to how it all works and the best way to go about it? I'm sure the best way is to approach a design company, but what do you need to know before approaching them (apart from the legal requirements that need too be on the label)? I realize this must seem a little rudimentary but just want to get my ducks in a row so I don't look stupid 🙂 Thanks for any help Sim

Thanks again Galapadoc As far as I can figure, Its all a bit vague. When I called Health and safety I was told there was no wrong way to develop a HACCP plan. I found the online .gov site that develops the plan for you by answering questions. The penultimate section basically asked you to prove your assumptions with evidence. I think I have what I need. If there are any issues then I can look further, I was hoping that someone that had been through all this might have jumped in but hey ho 😕 Thank you for your help !!! Thanks Thatch If I need to dig further I can ask around there ! Cheers !

Thanks Galapadoc Wow !! That's a ton of info !!! But perhaps I should have been a bit more specific in my request. I'm filling out the UK gov HACCP plan generator. I have to justify my assumptions about critical control points. These being that there is no real risk of biological hazards in distilled spirits over 15% ABV. At least, I thought that's what I had read somewhere. I will be producing spirits of at least 25% ABV but just used the 15% ABV as I thought that is what I had read, but Im damned if I can find where I read it now. Also, I know i read somewhere that it is accepted that allergens do not cause a hazard in distilled spirits as the distillation process removes the risk of contamination. I'll have to give the PubMed a try to see if I can find what I'm looking for. Thanks for your help. Much appreciated !

Hi All Im looking for some sort of Study or paper that states that there is no real risk of biological contamination hazard in Alcohol beverages over 15% ABV. Also looking for the same "study / papers" that states there is no real risk of allergenic contamination in distilled spirits. Can anyone advise me or point me in the right direction please. Ive tried to google but apparently I really suck at googleing 😕 Thanks Sim

Thanks for the reply Bluestar. Much appreciated !!! I was hoping to get a few responses and see what the general consensus was. Maybe some more folks might respond. But from other inquiries Ive had your info pretty much mirrors what others are telling me too. Cheers Sim

Hi All Just wondering what micron filers you are using pre bottling for whiskey and rums? I know everyone has different ideas and experiences so just thought Id ask for a quick post saying what you use? Thanks Sim

Again, many thanks for your input, advice and help. I'll try to digest all the info. Cheers 🙂

You my friend, are a star. !!! Thank you. I'll have a read and try to digest. !!! It certainty looks detailed from first glances.

Hi All I'm considering my future corn whiskey barrel aging program and was wondering if there are any books etc on how the spirit develops in flavour within the barrel as it ages? I know there are a million factors that can influence how a spirit ages, but I was after a description of how the flavour profile develops as the spirit sits in the cask. Ideally Id love to find descriptions for small casks, as always, Its about how I can get the best whiskey to market as quickly as possible in the early stages. Many thanks for your time to read this post Regards Sim

Thank you Andy! I have sent an email off to them to see what they can offer. Ive heard conflicting info about additions so good to get your take. Although I do have to say I was pretty impressed with Defiant's single malt when I tried it a few years ago at the ADI convention. Ugggggg, what to do !! But I think you are right. The only real way to go is to do it in the proper manner and source charred white American oak barrels. Thanks !!!!

Thanks for the replies guys! As I alreadyt import equipment to the UK I asked my shipping agent for a rough figure to ship 8 pallets (12cbm). I figured that would be a decent order of assorted sized barrels. The cost would be approx. $4,500 just in freight. Maybe its just the English/French thing but I really don't want to use French oak. I could get barrels coopered in France but don't want to go down that road unless I absolutely have to. And I believe that getting barrels coopered in France our of French oak is also expensive. Even though I don't have to abide by the rules of Bourbon, I may be better to just stick to shipping proper barrels from the US and not reinventing the wheel. I dunno.... There is only one proper cooper left in the UK as I'm aware. I tracked him down and emailed him asking of he can build me barrels out of new white American oak but have yet to hear back from him. I really don't want to touch the Scottish coopers or whatever you call them as I bought some old used up barrels for display purposes and when I pulled them apart the work that had been done to them was appalling. Rusty nails and generally botched up. Not touching that ! That's why I was considering oak additions. Just not sure what is the best way to turn to get a top notch product.

Hello All I have a bit of a problem that I'm hoping you guys can give me some thoughts on. I moved back home to South West England from Nashville TN to set up my small (and I do mean SMALL) distillery. We are a month or so away from starting production if all goes well. Of course we will start with the usual "white" spirit to get cash flowing but once we are off and running we intend to make American style whiskey (Bourbon by another name), rums and apple brandy. As I want to reproduce a "Bourbon" as closely as possible here in the UK, I will need to find a good way to age my product. Small 15-30 gallon barrels would be the obvious way to go in the first few years, but the shipping to the UK on already expensive small new barrels will be somewhat cost prohibitive but I am guaranteed a good product. Alternatively I could try oak additions but would have to source used small (15-30 gal) barrels to add additions to, but I'm not sure of the outcome for the finished spirit. And then there is tank aging with oak additions......... Has anyone experimented with any of these options or do you have any ideas or suggestions? Any and all help very gratefully received. Thanks in advance Sim Daley

Thanks Mike I will give it a look over ! Im not at present in production but nay in the planning & equipment gathering phase. Thanks for your input & I'll get with you if it looks like you could help me. Many thanks