New building option but need some insight

[1badcad]

Hello everyone, I was approached by a local resturant owner that is in the process of finishing their resturant. She was going to add a micro brewery but is out of funding. And since she knew that I was shopping for a building for my distillery she offered me the micro brewery space. Now my question is has anyone done a joint distillery with another business. I will be using square footage in her resturant area that was set aside for the brewery. Now I havent got the chance to approach the city with this option. But my main question is what does the TTB require for seperation between the businesses. Does a full wall work or can a half wall work for psyhical seperation. This is just the start in this new opportunity. Thanks for the input.

[TetonDistillery]

I have no idea if this is possible, but I have another comment.

I would be very careful. Your equipment will be locked up inside of her restaurant.

If this relationship goes bad, that could be a mess to untangle. I would have a contract that clearly spells out how to unwind this relationship also.

[Jedd Haas]

Having another business in the building is subject to approval by TTB. This is listed as one of the supplemental questions to answer in the permit application. I'd suggest contacting your local TTB investigator to find out any points of concern. If there is no ownership in common, then I suspect a half wall won't fly.

[Kristian]

Others have done it, a separate entrance and lockable doors separating the space will be necessary from the TTB side to "protect the revenue". You can have as many windows as you like but the fire marshall might be your biggest obstacle.

http://www.bardenay.com

[1badcad]

I had seen one or two setups like that. I know here in missouri there is a distillery/brewery/resturant and the brewery and distillery are on opposite sides of the rssturant just seperated by glass walls and an entry door. I need to make a trip back there and talk to them about it since this has changed my plans.

[bluestar]

You need a physical, secure separation. You need an access to the street that you control (others cannot control the locks for).

[Bier Distillery]

Can the only entrance to the bonded area from the outside be through a distillery general area, or does the bonded area need its own entrance from outside (public space)?

[bluestar]

Can the only entrance to the bonded area from the outside be through a distillery general area, or does the bonded area need its own entrance from outside (public space)?

We have heard different things at different times, so YMMV. But our best current understanding is that the bonded area must have access to the street through property that only you control, but it does not have to be bonded premise, general premise, or "distillery" at all. For example, it could be your retail shop (which can not be in bonded or general premises). Currently, we access our bonded premise through the general premise, which has a direct access to the street. We are thinking of changing the general premise into our retail space as part of an expansion of the distillery elsewhere, and then the street access to the bonded premise would be through the retail space. During the original application discussions, we had been told by the TTB that the latter would be acceptable, but we are now awaiting confirmation of such for approval of our planned change. We would have an additional entrance to the bonded space, but it would access the street through common public space that we don't have exclusive control of.

[clearwaterbrewer]

Along with an area that you can show protect the revenue by allowing very controlled access to certain named persons....

You will find most jurisdictions will want a separation between the occupancies, with a restaurant being Assembly and the distillery being Industrial/F1 or hazard/H3... you will likely be required to have a 2 or 3 hour fire separation, respectively.

NFPA 1 chapter 6.1.14

http://codesonline.nfpa.org/a/c.ref/ID020101110939/chapter

(go to 6.1.14.4)

Table 6.1.14.4.1(

http://codesonline.nfpa.org/imagepop.php?id=2012_tab_NFPA-101_6.1.14.4.1_b_

[bluestar]

Along with an area that you can show protect the revenue by allowing very controlled access to certain named persons....

You will find most jurisdictions will want a separation between the occupancies, with a restaurant being Assembly and the distillery being Industrial/F1 or hazard/H3... you will likely be required to have a 2 or 3 hour fire separation, respectively.

The bonded premise MUST be controlled access to protect revenue (see CFR). But if you pass through a restaurant to get to the bonded area, for example, it but must be under your control (ownership, leasehold, operation). And no public access into or through the bonded premise or general premise is allowed (for access to bathroom or fire door required by code, for example). But as to fire hazard zones, depends on local interpretation, depends on the building, and is a separate question. Our bonded area is F1, and the other areas B or A, but the entire building is a single zone, so fire separations are not required.

[clearwaterbrewer]

"But as to fire hazard zones, depends on local interpretation, depends on the building, and is a separate question. Our bonded area is F1, and the other areas B or A, but the entire building is a single zone, so fire separations are not required."

interested in how they interpret it to be that way (a single zone)... F1, B, and A are all occupancies, and separation of occupancy seems fairly straightforward... I could see it being A occupancy with 'incidental' F1 and B??? If you have a way of describing how they did it, I sure would appreciate it!