grehorst Posted February 8, 2008 Share Posted February 8, 2008 Posted at the request of Bill Owens... Hi Bill, I e-mailed you previously about legislation that will be introduced in our state to allow farm distillery operations. I spoke with the TTB and they said no sampling can occur on the bonded facility. Do you know of any distilleries that are using a work around to be able to provide sampling. I would like to contact them to discuss. The TTB told me the only way was to have a seperate retail license and not within the bonded premises. Thanks, Jeff Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coop Posted February 8, 2008 Share Posted February 8, 2008 Posted at the request of Bill Owens...Hi Bill, I e-mailed you previously about legislation that will be introduced in our state to allow farm distillery operations. I spoke with the TTB and they said no sampling can occur on the bonded facility. Do you know of any distilleries that are using a work around to be able to provide sampling. I would like to contact them to discuss. The TTB told me the only way was to have a seperate retail license and not within the bonded premises. Thanks, Jeff We here at Colorado Gold Distillery have a retail store on site and are allowed to offer samplings within our store. We can also sell OUR products only on site without another license. It is legal in the state of Colorado and allowed by the TTB. Our store is in the same building but and this is KEY, not a part of the bonded area. Coop Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jonathan Forester Posted February 8, 2008 Share Posted February 8, 2008 It would be helpful if we knew what state Jeff, is in? Every state has different laws and "work-arounds." Posted at the request of Bill Owens...Hi Bill, I e-mailed you previously about legislation that will be introduced in our state to allow farm distillery operations. I spoke with the TTB and they said no sampling can occur on the bonded facility. Do you know of any distilleries that are using a work around to be able to provide sampling. I would like to contact them to discuss. The TTB told me the only way was to have a seperate retail license and not within the bonded premises. Thanks, Jeff Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff Posted February 10, 2008 Share Posted February 10, 2008 It would be helpful if we knew what state Jeff, is in? Every state has different laws and "work-arounds." I am from North Dakota and currently have sponsors for a bill to be introduced next session allowing farm distillery operations. I want to be able to provide sampling within the laws of what the TTB allows and make sure the bill provides for that privilage within the state statute. From a previous post I gather that all that is required is the ability to retail on the state level and have the retail section in an unbonded area. Any thoughts or suggestions? Jeff Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charles@AEppelTreow Posted February 11, 2008 Share Posted February 11, 2008 On the wine/cider side of things, a sales area is _usually_ outside of the bonded area. But not always. The federal winery operations report (double sided 11x17 page) has a line item for sampling/tasting that doesn't seem to have an equivalent on the DSP form. The TTB agent that came out when I added the DSP to the BW didn't have an issue with wine sales from the BW, as long as I logged the removals daily. Since the DSP is technically adjacent to the BW, that still would put any prospective spirits sales off the DSP. (And they aren't allowed by WI law, yet...) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
delaware_phoenix Posted February 22, 2008 Share Posted February 22, 2008 The NY Farm Distiller law allows sales and tastings as well, but I don't think it's expected that the sampling room is right in the bonded warehouse. Ralph Erenzo would know more. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff Posted March 2, 2008 Share Posted March 2, 2008 The NY Farm Distiller law allows sales and tastings as well, but I don't think it's expected that the sampling room is right in the bonded warehouse. Ralph Erenzo would know more. Does anyone have an idea how many states have provisions allowing sampling? I see New York and Colorado from previous posts. Jeff Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Donald R Outterson Posted March 9, 2008 Share Posted March 9, 2008 You may designate the tasting room for tax paid spirits only, which take's it out of the bonded area and therefore becomes legal. Hope this helps. Donald R Outterson Posted at the request of Bill Owens...Hi Bill, I e-mailed you previously about legislation that will be introduced in our state to allow farm distillery operations. I spoke with the TTB and they said no sampling can occur on the bonded facility. Do you know of any distilleries that are using a work around to be able to provide sampling. I would like to contact them to discuss. The TTB told me the only way was to have a seperate retail license and not within the bonded premises. Thanks, Jeff Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rum Posted May 20, 2008 Share Posted May 20, 2008 Does the TTB allow tasting for non-retail purposes on the bonded premises? For example, if I bring in a bunch of local bar tenders for a distillery tour can I serve samples? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
delaware_phoenix Posted May 28, 2008 Share Posted May 28, 2008 If you look at 27 CFR 19.701, 19.702 and 19.703 you'll have your answer. This is where samples are discussed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest sensei Posted July 24, 2008 Share Posted July 24, 2008 We can also sell OUR products only on site without another license. It is legal in the state of Colorado and allowed by the TTB. Our store is in the same building but and this is KEY, not a part of the bonded area. Coop This is how Jack Daniel's and George Dickel sell product at the distillery. The areas are within buildings, but have their own door and cash register. When you enter the room, you "leave" the distillery property and is how each explained how they were able to sell "on premises". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andrew Posted July 24, 2008 Share Posted July 24, 2008 This is how Jack Daniel's and George Dickel sell product at the distillery. The areas are within buildings, but have their own door and cash register. When you enter the room, you "leave" the distillery property and is how each explained how they were able to sell "on premises". It's still the distillery property, it's just not part of the bonded area. TN allows DSP's to have gift shop sales of spirits produced at the same site as the gift shop, which is nice. It's just the rest of Tennessee's distillery laws that are nonsense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest sensei Posted July 24, 2008 Share Posted July 24, 2008 TN allows DSP's to have gift shop sales of spirits produced at the same site as the gift shop, which is nice. It's just the rest of Tennessee's distillery laws that are nonsense. Absolutely true. Distilleries are only legally allowed in Lincoln (Pritchard's Rum), Moore (Jack), and Coffee (George Dickel and my home) counties. It would be cool to have a distillery in downtown Nashville, but legally not possible. Why the legislature says no to more tax revenue I have no idea. Many laws concerning alcohol in the US are nonsense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charles@AEppelTreow Posted July 24, 2008 Share Posted July 24, 2008 Why? Because the temperance movement is not gone. It's not [usually] noisy, and it doesn't go by last century's names - but it's there. Alcohol regulation is a weapon with many edges. Collection (and protection) of tax revenue and consumer protection (honest labelling) get most of the talk. But take a look at the 4 Prohibited Practices in Title 27. They [supposedly] are anti-corruption measures - and every one has the the practical effect of raising the price the consumer pays for alcohol. Or at least blocking efficiencies that reduce prices. Likewise with the manadatory use of all three Tiers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ralph at Tuthilltown Posted April 30, 2010 Share Posted April 30, 2010 In New York at a recent conference on wineries and distilleries in New York, one seminar included the Chief Counsel of the NYS SLA and a representative from the Licensing Division of the TTB. This question came up. The two looked at each other and shrugged and smiled. They acknowledged the contradictions in the law(s) relating to this question between States' laws and Federal regulations. In general the answer they seemed to be giving was that the Fed has no intention of challenging State's rights to control distribution and sale of alcoholic beverages, the Federal regulation notwithstanding. It's another version of "don't ask, don't tell". I'm willing to bet the overwhelming majority of distilleries, wineries and breweries are in violation of some Federal regulation or another but in compliance with their State regs. Best advice, stay in compliance with the laws to the best of your ability and in good faith and pay your taxes. If it comes down to a fight, the States will scream that prohibiting tastings and tours through working distilleries will eliminate all the tax the States collect on sales that result from those tastings and tours. Not to mention the loss of excise tax when new small distillers fail because they can not properly promote and sell their goods. And did I mention, pay your taxes. Both representatives agreed on one thing, all else can be resolved, but you have to pay your taxes or no mercy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HedgeBird Posted September 9, 2011 Share Posted September 9, 2011 Coming late to this thread, but my questions seems to fit here. Does the TTB allow you to operate a distillery in conjuncture with other businesses located within the same building? For example, I know I have seen distillery operations added to existing breweries. How separate do you need to keep operations, or do you just bond the entire production area? Could someone open a distillery and a bar within the same space? This of course assumes all proper state/local licenses etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flip2spin23 Posted October 11, 2011 Share Posted October 11, 2011 Absolutely true. Distilleries are only legally allowed in Lincoln (Pritchard's Rum), Moore (Jack), and Coffee (George Dickel and my home) counties. It would be cool to have a distillery in downtown Nashville, but legally not possible. Why the legislature says no to more tax revenue I have no idea. Many laws concerning alcohol in the US are nonsense. What about Sevier (OSD) We have a dsp there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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