Jump to content
ADI Forums
rickthenewb

Anyone have experience w/ Affordable Distillery Equipment LLC??

Recommended Posts

Hi Rick

The still in the picture, is our 300 gallon, pro series, combination mash tun still, and it includes the electric baine marie heating system.  The price is $36,132.00  The heat up to operating temp time, is around 1.5 hrs. The typical run time after operating temp is reached is only 4 hrs.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Hi Paul, is it cost effective to use a baine marie for a 500-600 gallon still.  I am just curious of the electric costs and run times.  Also, does your page have current prices of these larger baine marie stills?

 

thank you

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

It is only cost effective in that size if there is no way that you can  have an oil, Natural Gas or Propane Fired Boiler.  The run time for whiskey, after the operating temp is reached is only 4 to 5 hrs.  For prices on the big baine maries, you will need to email.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Silk City.

Yes, it is best if you have a 480 volt service, but we can build them for 208v, 230v or 240v 3 phase as well as 220v, 230v, 240v or 480v single phase.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, Southernhighlander said:

Silk City.

Yes, it is best if you have a 480 volt service, but we can build them for 208v, 230v or 240v 3 phase as well as 220v, 230v, 240v or 480v single phase.

Paul, I think his point is that the amperage to run a still that size can be so large at the lower voltages, that it becomes impractical. Or in some cases, you can't get that size service. Some places are limited to 200 amps per leg (we are). Even at 300 amps per leg, you would have a challenge running a 600 gallon still at 208V 3 phase if the column is 16" or more, but 200 amps per leg on 480V 3 phase should be no problem.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

bluestar,

I understood silkcity's point, which is why I said it is best to have 480v, and I certainly would not try to sell a customer a single phase still when that is not what they need.  On the contrary, my point is that;  I'm here to sell people the still that meets their specific needs.  Believe it or not, there is a very broad range of specific needs out there.  

  I recently sold a 300 gallon still to a man in a rural area, with no access to 3 phase, but he has 400 amps of single phase 240vac power in a building that once housed a small log furniture factory.  He tried multiple equipment suppliers, before he came to me, and the two suppliers that did sell electric baine marie stills, said that it was unpractical to sell their electric Baine Marie stills in sizes larger than 150 gallons, and that they did not have any stills with single phase power.  I on the other had exactly what he needed.  His still has a 66kW heating system drawing 275 amps at 240vac single phase.  I tried to push him toward a NG or LP fired low pressure steam boiler, but due to multiple factors beyond his control the low pressure steam boiler solution did not work for him. 

 

  I have sold around 15 electric Baine Marie Stills  larger than 150 gallons.  Several were 300 gallons and the largest is 500 gallon with a 110,000 watt 240vac 3 phase heating system drawing 265 amps.  I was guaranteed those sales, because my competitors thought it impractical to sell such things.  Along with the sale of almost every still I sold the fermenters, mash cookers, mash pumps, CIP  systems, pneumatic ethanol pumps, hoses, air compressors, receiving tanks, blending tanks, proofing tanks, etc.   Not everyone bought all of their components from me, but most did.  We are talking well over $1,000,000.00 in sales, because I could meet those peoples expectations, while my competitors couldn't.  Here is how I do business:  I try to have equipment to meet the needs of any customer no matter what those needs may be.  Many times the customers in this business have so little experience and knowledge that they don't really know what their needs are, so I ask a great many questions to determine what equipment best meets their needs.  While many of my competitors just want to sell the customer a still, with as little time, as possible invested in the sale, and then get them out of their hair,  I want to sell the customer the still and other equipment that is most likely to make them successful.  If that means, I spend 1 hr on the phone on the first call and dozens of hours on emails then so be it, because I know if he or she is successful they will come back and buy larger equipment when they up size.  I have had some customers buy as many as 4 sets of equipment in 6 years which means I did my job pretty dam well.  Also I never try to sell a customer anything that they do not need and I have systems that fit almost any budget.

Speaking of electrical services.  I have a 1,000 amp 240vac electrical service here.  My employees run a bunch of large 3 phase and single phase Miller sincrowave welders, as well as a great deal of other fabricating and metal working equipment, from that 1000 amp service and of course, there is my electrical department with the construction area and a huge heating system test bed, that is set up to run all sizes of panels in all phases and voltages of American current, except for 600vac and 120vac.  I know I'm going to hear, you can't do that, you are limited to single phase 240vac power.  All 12,000 square ft of my shop, ware house and office space here was either wired by me or by my employees under my supervision.

When I had my wood products business here, I had around 20 three phase motors, totaling over 350 hp, that all ran at the same time.  There was 1 primary rotary phase converter, which was just an old used 40 hp motor that I bought from a junk dealer for peanuts, wired a little funny, with no start or run capacitors and a single phase pony motor to spin it up.  Each of the other motors that ran the machinery acted as secondary phase converters, when not under a load. None of those motors were ever under full load, at the same time.  Only 40% of them would have been under their max load at the same time, when we were running flat out with 8 employees (I automated as much as I could). All this was from a 1000 amp single phase 240volt power supply.  Most every licensed electrician and electrical engineer will tell you that the electrical system, I just described could not possibly work, but they would be wrong.  I experimented for days before I figured it out.  See, I'm out in a very rural area, on the edge of the grid.  It is not possible to get 3 phase power out here.  A guy up the road from me tried to run a band saw mill with a 25hp 3 phase motor, using a professionally manufactured 40 hp phase converter.  The 40hp created so much lamp flicker, when he started it, that the power company pulled his meter.  I figured out a way around the lamp flicker in just a few minutes (no start capacitors) and the no start capacitor restriction helped me figure out a type of phase converter that is different than the norm and I still use one today for my 3 phase 300 and 500 amp Miller Sincrowave welders.  I figure things out by experimentation and the taking of copious notes.  The main thing that allowed me to do what I did, was the fact that there are no required electrical inspections here.  I won't go on any further about this because no one is probably interested and it only fits the thread, because it shows my ingenuity and ability to think outside the box.  If anyone really wants to know how it worked I can explain it and show pics of my current phase converter.  I found out later, that I was certainly not the first person to do it the way that I did, but it is still pretty uncommon.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Paul, we share the same mindset.   If I was in a shed in the middle of nowhere trying to run a big electric still, I'd get it running.  I'd fire up my TIG and weld up a couple hundred hp motor to a tractor PTO, and I'd have it running.  But, at the same time, you've got to acknowledge the practicality and the poor long-run TCO of batch electric.  There is an upper limit, beyond which practicality falls off, and the long-run TCO is simply worse than most other alternatives.  If another manufacturer is going to set a limit, that's their prerogative and they probably have a good reason for why they think that's a limit.  My point was simply that if one was hell bent on running electric, and they had 480v service, they should consider themselves very fortunate, as it makes things much easier at that scale.  It's along the same lines of walking into your potential location and seeing an adequate sprinkler system already installed,  It's like money in the bank.  But greenfield?  In my neck of the woods dropping adequate power into a commercial building would cost north of $25k, and with electric rates nearly 4-5x the cost of gas, it simply doesn't make sense.  If you've got a building in the styx and need to make it work, well, I guess you gotta do what you gotta do to make it work.

I think the real game changer for those who are space, cost, or power constrained (or all 3) is a reasonably priced smaller scale electric stripping still that can handle solids and grain-in wash.  Trade off time for lower power requirements, assuming that said still can run with only needing monitoring through the run (no fiddling).  Now you go from needing that monster 600g to a much more reasonably sized finishing still, and with immersion elements, very affordable.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, Silk City Distillers said:

Paul, we share the same mindset.   If I was in a shed in the middle of nowhere trying to run a big electric still, I'd get it running.  I'd fire up my TIG and weld up a couple hundred hp motor to a tractor PTO, and I'd have it running.  But, at the same time, you've got to acknowledge the practicality and the poor long-run TCO of batch electric.  There is an upper limit, beyond which practicality falls off, and the long-run TCO is simply worse than most other alternatives.  If another manufacturer is going to set a limit, that's their prerogative and they probably have a good reason for why they think that's a limit.  My point was simply that if one was hell bent on running electric, and they had 480v service, they should consider themselves very fortunate, as it makes things much easier at that scale.  It's along the same lines of walking into your potential location and seeing an adequate sprinkler system already installed,  It's like money in the bank.  But greenfield?  In my neck of the woods dropping adequate power into a commercial building would cost north of $25k, and with electric rates nearly 4-5x the cost of gas, it simply doesn't make sense.  If you've got a building in the styx and need to make it work, well, I guess you gotta do what you gotta do to make it work.

I agree with everything you wrote above and no where did I disagree.  However, if the customers only viable option is a 300 gallon electric still running on single phase I am very glad to sell it to him/her and that is absolutely the right thing for me to do.  So unless you are disagreeing with that we are on the same page. 

  I know my business better than anyone.  It is what I do everyday, 7 days most weeks.  I love and enjoy every day of it.

As far as it being my competitors prerogative to not sell larger electric stills, that is 100% correct.  I hope they keep doing it that way, so I can keep getting the millions in business that they are missing out on.  

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Was down in Springfield last week for a couple days, down through Branson and down to Harrison.  I would have loved to stop in, but probably too far west.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I would love to have you visit.  We are 2.5 hours east of Springfield, 20 minutes east of the small town of Alton MO off 160 highway.  If you want to vist and take the tour let me know and I will send you directions.  GPS won't find me.  If you visit I will show you some very interesting stuff.

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

We just finished the 200 gallon ultra Pro Vodka Still in the picture, yesterday.  We have 2 of them (twins) going to a distillery in New Jersey next week.

 

PA300101.JPG.e13d2e5ac0bf6bab836f492c3dae32dd.JPG

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I have a decent sized order in with them currently that we placed in June.  I don't know the quality of it because it hasn't come yet.  I've been making periodic inquiries over the past month as to whether it would be delivered on time (we have an event scheduled, tonight actually, that we wanted it for), but they still don't have a shipping date for me.  That part has been very frustrating, but they are always friendly on the phone and return emails typically the following day.

JP Bernier
Hammer Spring Distillers
Salt Lake City, UT.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Hi JP,

 

As long as nothing goes wrong we will ship your equipment from here within the next 2 weeks.  I am very sorry that we could not get it to you before your event.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Hi JP,

Your equipment just went into one of our shops for testing and final processing.  We should be done with it and have pictures over to you within the next couple of days.

Thank you

Paul

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Belew are pics of JPs completed equipment

 

125 gallon Conical Fermenters only $1,993.10 each

PB210003.JPG.43ba2637b1c8e94ec6d9434fa5ae2dba.JPG

 

105 gallon open top baine marie mash tun with removable cooling coil and agitator only $6,293.14 as shown

PB210006.JPG.e41f1ead34788a99a49d62e084a87955.JPG

 

Mash tun removable crash cooling coil, agitator shaft and paddles shown below.

PB220018.JPG.bc0e3e3681b51f100dd55ca0aa6a9831.JPG

The best costs less at Affordable Distillery Equipment

http://distillery-equipment.com

http://moonshine-still.co

http://triclamp.co

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Just to let everyone know we have some really exciting things going on in research and development.  We have a new line of stills that will be coming out February 1st 2018  These can be fired with indirect heat from electricity, firewood, natural gas, heating oil, diesel fuel, burnt motor oil and almost any other thing that is combustible.  These stills  operate under vacuum, so that distillation takes place at around 130 F.  Since distillation takes place at such a low temp and there are no ignition sources within the class one division two environment around the still these will undoubtedly be the safest beverage ethanol stills out there.  Including the heating systems these stills will have a better price point than almost all of our competitors stills of the same capacities.  I think that these stills will be the biggest change in commonly used still design in the last 50 years.

We also have a new line of stills for washes without solids such as rum and barley washes.  The price point is unbelievable.  the 200 gallon complete still with 4 plate copper and stainless, bubble plate column and 33,000 watt electric heating system with controller is less than $10,000.00  These are for sale now.  I will post some pics in a few days.

  • reaction_title_1 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Hey Paul,

What's the footprint of the still you describe in your post?

Are you still able to achieve a Maillard reaction at these lower temps under vacuum?

 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Thatch

Sorry I didn't get back to you sooner.  I do historical reenacting, so I was gone all weekend with the 4th Missouri  Infantry at the battle of Pea Ridge Arkansas.  Anyway, I didn't have any of my modern electronic contrivances there.

The footprint of the 200 gallon single wall electric still that I mentioned above is 4'x5'.  We can also build it as a single retort or double retort rum still.

Our vacuum stills have no less of a Maillard reaction than any steam jacketed still operating at less than 15 psi.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I am in the process of setting up a distillery and had the opportunity to tour Affordable Distillery's operation. I have not used his equipment yet, so I cannot speak to that end, but I can tell you he spent more time with me than he probably needed to and was a complete open book regarding his operations. I am excited to formulate my order with him. After meeting Paul and his staff, I am sure I have made the right choice. 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Good luck River City, if you need any budgets on cooling systems, give me a shout.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now

×