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They also have this unit, which is worth considering, although not NTEP:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/New-700lb-x-0-1lb-44-x22-Animal-Scale-Vet-Scale-Pet-Scale-w-Hold-Button-/181674820811

Ignore its description as a pet scale. It can be used for anything. 700lbs should be adequate, since CFR limits you to scale weighing 55 gallon containers, and they seldom weigh more than 500 lbs (460 lbs of water plus container tare). It is twice as accurate at 0.1 lb instead of 0.2 lb. It is larger area (which could be a plus or minus), but it is a stainless platen, which you want in case you spill high proof alcohol. It is still not washdown, but neither is the cheaper version of the NTEP. 

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On 7/24/2017 at 3:10 PM, Silk City Distillers said:

For a while I thought about fabricating and selling universal flat bottom tank scales.  For example, for standard Letina, Marchiso, etc wine tanks.  4 legs, stainless frame, integral load cells, integral level, and a lip to keep tanks centered.

And what happened? That's a fantastic idea.

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On 9/2/2017 at 9:21 AM, bluestar said:

They also have this unit, which is worth considering, although not NTEP:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/New-700lb-x-0-1lb-44-x22-Animal-Scale-Vet-Scale-Pet-Scale-w-Hold-Button-/181674820811

Ignore its description as a pet scale. It can be used for anything. 700lbs should be adequate, since CFR limits you to scale weighing 55 gallon containers, and they seldom weigh more than 500 lbs (460 lbs of water plus container tare). It is twice as accurate at 0.1 lb instead of 0.2 lb. It is larger area (which could be a plus or minus), but it is a stainless platen, which you want in case you spill high proof alcohol. It is still not washdown, but neither is the cheaper version of the NTEP. 

I just got an email offer for a similar scale from Prime, their model PS-AS4320 

https://www.paypal.com/webapps/shoppingcart?mid=2698762161078454749128381505833303&flowlogging_id=e15cf64f59589#/checkout/shoppingCart

It's only $300, 1000 lb capacity, and 0.2 lb resolution. Another vet scale, not NTEP, but again work great for measuring up to full barrels or even 100 gallon tanks.

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All these requirements sure make it tough on the little guy.  You have to be a scientist, mathematician, lawyer, CPA, etc.

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On ‎7‎/‎22‎/‎2017 at 10:53 AM, Natrat said:

Getting your certification to calibrate your own scales is pretty easy. The calibration weights are a bit expensive, but the process is pretty straightforward. It took me about $300 and 3 days to get my NTEP and ATOCT certifications, and the only set of calibration weights I have are for my lab scales. The 1 kg weight was about $200. Individual load cells need to be able to be dismounted from their tank to be properly calibrated. 

Can you point us in the direction to be able to calibrate our own scales?

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On 9/2/2017 at 9:21 AM, bluestar said:

They also have this unit, which is worth considering, although not NTEP:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/New-700lb-x-0-1lb-44-x22-Animal-Scale-Vet-Scale-Pet-Scale-w-Hold-Button-/181674820811

Ignore its description as a pet scale. It can be used for anything. 700lbs should be adequate, since CFR limits you to scale weighing 55 gallon containers, and they seldom weigh more than 500 lbs (460 lbs of water plus container tare). It is twice as accurate at 0.1 lb instead of 0.2 lb. It is larger area (which could be a plus or minus), but it is a stainless platen, which you want in case you spill high proof alcohol. It is still not washdown, but neither is the cheaper version of the NTEP. 

What CFR limits you to scale weighing up to 55 gallon containers?

Also, is the scale holding the container for finished spirits being bottled considered to be in a Class I Division 1 or Division 2 area?  That is, do these scales need to be "explosion proof"?

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9 hours ago, Bartletts Distillery said:

What CFR limits you to scale weighing up to 55 gallon containers?

Also, is the scale holding the container for finished spirits being bottled considered to be in a Class I Division 1 or Division 2 area?  That is, do these scales need to be "explosion proof"?

We went with IS or intrinsically safe, I’m not aware of explosion proof scales being available. IS standards for scales and load cells are appropriate for classified areas. We had the low voltage power come out to a non-classified area with seal offs, and then a standard AC adapter for power to the scale. 

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On 1/23/2018 at 11:41 AM, Bartletts Distillery said:

What CFR limits you to scale weighing up to 55 gallon containers?

Also, is the scale holding the container for finished spirits being bottled considered to be in a Class I Division 1 or Division 2 area?  That is, do these scales need to be "explosion proof"?

19.183 (Scale tanks) (b) The requirement to mount tanks on scales does not apply to tanks having a capacity of 55 gallons or less. Such tanks may be moved onto an accurately calibrated scale when a tax determination gauge needs to be made.

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On 7/21/2017 at 10:55 AM, Silk City Distillers said:

Can you tell I like scales yet?

Every distillery should have 3 scales.

Yes, get out your pocket book, you should have 3 scales:

Scale #1 - Sized for the maximum amount of spirit you deal with in Production.

Scale #2 - Sized for the maximum amount of spirit you produce in Processing.

Scale #3 - Sized to check weight a filled bottle for verifying filling accuracy in Bottling.

 

Thanks for the Info Silk City. I haven't seen any mention of scale for determination of obscuration of proof by evaporation.  The TTB video says "an analytical balance reading to at least 4 decimal places" and shows  a 2.4166 gram readout, which would equal 0.1mg readout; but I don't see anything in the gauging manual to back that up. It seems exorbitantly accurate to me but maybe I am missing something. I am ignoring the difference between readout and accuracy which was pointed out, because the video specifically mentions readout.

400mg sugar per 100ml would be minimum reading of 100mg per 25ml sample.  At readout of 1 mg that is max 0.5% error, and if the proof is obscured by 1.6 degree per 400mg/100ml than the error due to scale accuracy becomes 0.008 degree of proof.  I would think that is within the bounds of what is required. At 0.1mg readout this becomes 0.0008 degree proof.  

I just got a $435.10  0.1mg readout scale (repeatability +- 0.3mg) from Amazon for this purpose but it is not NTEP.

Prime scales gave me a quote for $1,000 and said the NTEP version would be 3-4 times more. I am going to go on the assumption I don't need NTEP for this since the potential for error is so small.

Thanks for any feedback.

 

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