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Everything posted by patrick260z

  1. Just to expand on what PeteB said concerning the regs for using bad wine. You must call it substandard brandy, but that is only for wine with major microbial spoilage. So high VA wines, basically. Highly oxidized wines... aka Sherry do not fall into that category. There may be limits to the g/100mL of VA set for distilling wine that are different for those set for bottled wines.
  2. Copper carbonate? It's green. You said you use soda ash, right? Maybe residual soda ash, not complete neutralized by the citric or rinsed out by the hot water reacting with the copper condenser. Have also heard of excessively gassy (CO2) charges can also cause lime green distillates.
  3. Good insight with the rum production. Seems a single run "all in" for that one hour of reflux might give enough difference to compare with a standard run, if there is any.
  4. How much reaction can take place in the few hours of heat applied during distillation? In my observation and understanding most esterfication takes place in the barrel. My understanding is that these reaction take a long duration of heat, and your organic acids are coming from whats in the wood. If you can't find the answer, run multiple trials with the variable being heat. Would be interesting.
  5. Blue, you're absolutely correct about everything you've said. However, the intent to use the copper sulfate was not to buffer against sulfuric acid reducing to sulfite. It's to react with H2S. I don't believe the problem being discussed is a SO2 problem and I don't think its plausible that a wine (unless completely bleached with sulfur) would ever be saturated with sulfate. It sounds like a reductive wine problem. One can lab bench trial for reduced wines based on the Scott Labs methods found on their website, I believe. Find out which treatment (just Cu or Ascorbic + Cu) changes the smell of the wine material the most. That being said, ascorbic acid can really tear up a wine, too. Just as blue said earlier, your best wines are going to be the wines you don't have to treat for sulfur.
  6. If it is stinky sulfur then you have hydrogen sulphite or a more stable mercaptan. Hydrogen sulphite is readily reactive with elemental copper. So a clean copper surface in your vapor path should clean it up. Additionally, a copper pot would also help. In lieu of those, copper sulfate (the blue granulated type) can be added to the pot upon charging and should strip out the stink. Make sure to hydrate the copper sulfate w/ distilled/RO water. If it is a more stable mercaptan, you'll need to brake the mercaptan apart with an ascorbic acid treatment, then treat the released hydrogen sulphite with the copper. The "sulfite" I think a lot of people are talking on this thread about, is the Free unbound SO2. Smells more like a match stick and is a very harsh respiratory irritant. Very different then the reduced sulfur smell talked about above. If it is that, hydrogen peroxide will take it out to produce sulfuric acid. Sulfuric acid will stay in solution and not distill off. This is a reaction that, if there are large amounts of so2 in the wine, takes some time to reach equilibrium. You also need to make sure when you add it to heavily so2 wines, you'll need to agitate the wine and slowly add the H2O2. If it is just a slight (less then 10ppm TSO2) amount, then toss it directly to the pot upon charging. Classick's mention of the web site add calculator is a solid tool. I've used it myself.
  7. reduction stink? Like rotten egg?
  8. Thank you, very good information. I had heard of there being issues with congener precipitation below 90 proof, but what you're saying makes good sense. Thank you for all the information!
  9. jamie, thank you for the reply. That's really interesting. So now the next question... how slow? Thanks!
  10. Great info, glisade. Pointed me in the right direction, anyway. So, is the slow watering back method to keep congeners suspended or avoiding de-esterification? Is it primarily to preserve a clear liquid or preserve bouquet/aroma? Both? Anyone? T
  11. Hey y'all, Doing some research concerning grappa production and I've found something that keeps popping up. Seems some producers water their grappas back to bottling proof in small doses over long periods of time, sometimes months. Is anyone out there doing this? Any resources out there explaining why this is done, and how it works? Thanks
  12. I understand the production of methanol using enzymatic activity on pectin, but I'm more interested in what's being broken down into fermentable sugars when it comes to enzyme use on grappa pomace/grape skins, as mentioned by mcsology. Or is that not what was being suggested?
  13. mcsology~ Interesting info about the enzymes. Can you elaborate?
  14. Meerkat; I believe, per the illustration provided by StonesRyan their still has the dip pipe design.
  15. Your effectively making blueberry wine for distilling, right? And its in a carboy? How does it smell? Do you have a press?
  16. Dave, I think you'll find, if you were to measure the FSO2 of your distillate you'll find SO2. We worked with some Muscat last year that needed to be H2O2'ed. Even with the addition, we could smell it across the distillate as it came off, albeit at a very low rate. Ended up having to add more to the distillate, water back and re-run. Our experience was that the basic calculation rate is not enough to convert all the SO2 into Sulfuric. The pH shift along with the addition of heat, plus the relatively short time between peroxide addition and distillation, ment that we had to overshoot our H2O2 addition to meet our target. Our last large run of Chenin Blanc had only a slight residual of FSO2 measured through Aeration-Oxidation. Measured at 1-3ppm. We treated each 100 gallon charge with 30mL of 35% concentration H2O2. We tossed the peroxide in right before shutting the door and turning on the agitator and steam. Worked brilliantly. You know something just occurred to me. We did a run a while back, in fact it was while we were trying to dial in an H2O2 add, we way over-shot. The fumes that came off during distillation were suffocating, but in the weirdest way. We had to kill the steam and evacuate the facility to let it air out. However, the metallic taste you describe in your mouth after coughing sounds like residual SO2, not this other phenomenon. Good Luck -Patrick
  17. www.keyindustrial.com They make all our fabricated stainless fittings.
  18. Have you compared the filtered to unfiltered blindly after a month or so? From my experience with wine, differences in flavors between filtered and unfiltered only existed shortly after filtration. After about a month, when compared blindly, were near- indistinguishable. Additionally, some filtration methods can introduce dissolved oxygen into the solution. Which can also affect flavor. What type of filtration system are you using?
  19. Our distillery has not been around long enough to give any advice on that question. I can't find anything in the regs regarding that and haven't heard anyone's advice related to the matter of re-calibration. Sorry
  20. McKee, I really don't know for sure, I meant to pose it more as a question, so no worries maybe it is overkill, maybe it isnt. Cant see it hurting, right? John O., As I understand it, most if not all leaf filters use DE. So the disposal of DE can be a challenge. Additionally, your operator's safety needs to be considered, as the dry DE can cause significant lung damage over prolonged exposure. There may be regulations regarding its use, I don't know.
  21. Is .5 micron necessary? Thats nearly microbial, 1 micron has been traditionally called a polishing filter in winemaking, as it gets it to crystal clear. Is there any need to go tighter? Thanks The pressure leaf filter, that uses DE, correct?
  22. It looks like they believe an airlock is forming in your condensate return pipe. Would that suggest pressure in the pot is too high for the condensate to "push" back into the pot. Wouldn't a better fix be a bigger return pipe or lower heat/pressure in the pot? Not suggesting you get to work on that, more of a general design question. What kind of rake angle is in that return pipe?
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