Retired Distillery hand. :)

[DrDistillation]

Hello everyone,

I've been reading this and other forums for quite a while but never signed up, to not get myself in trouble with my previous employer.   I'm now retired from an Indiana "wholesale" company that I think everyone will know without me saying.  If anyone wonders shoot me a PM (rather not say publicly).  But it's probably the biggest distillery that the average consumer never heard of. Many of you know the company I'm sure, as I recognize your company names as buying our GNS and rye whiskeys.

I'm now 100% retired after working for them for just shy of 38 years (under multiple parent names/ownership). My last decade or so I was more or less what I'll call a floater and worked with many teams sharing knowledge from R&D, to grain sourcing, fermentation, distilling, computer control ("refinement of recipes"), experimental recipes, lab & blending.  I've had the pleasure of working on many different types of equipment and recipes and can say beside normal corporate BS that all large companies have, LOVED my job. Being able to work internally as an inside consultant was really a lot of fun and a good way to make a living without doing a "lot of manual work", LOL. God only knows I put my time in on manual work over the years!

I've got a lot of experience and overall knowledge that I'll try and share where appropriate , when I can, but I'm not a guy who thinks there is only one way to do things.  I'll happily share (if I can) what I personally think is the best way to do something based on experience if asked, but recognize it's just my opinion based on what I personally like, know or have experienced.  I've always felt, no matter the amount of experience, no one knows it all, and the day you stop listening and possibly learning from others, is the day you stop progressing in your passion and/or profession.

I'm now focused on doing personal things I've always wanted to do such as actually using my sail boat, doing some personal traveling, spending much more time with family and enjoying life at large,  so I'll probably be active and non-active in waves depending on personal life preferences. Gonna try and strike off as many things I can from my personal bucket list while health allows.

On a personal note related to the forum/alcohol, I've been making my own wines and beers with family for a couple of decades.  As a retired person from the field, I now just enjoy playing with different types of stills (all small/home scale under 50 gallon) to allow me to build and try things I didn't have the liberty to previously.  I'm playing with heirloom corn strains, ways of malting and peating to alternative LCP type filtering of whiskey. 

So anyway, that's me and my introduction (finally).

[Hudson bay distillers]

Welcome looking forward to your input

[stevea]

I'm pretty certain every person here has a notion of who RBID (Really-big-Indiana-Distiller) is.  I've seen their ~24k-27k gallon fermenters and the several big column stills.

Out of curiosity - do they use more than a continuous doubler before barreling ?

LCP ?   I'm missing that acronym.

 

 

[Silk City Distillers]

Amazing experience!  Glad to have you here.

[Sudzie]

Looking forward to your tidbits of wisdom.  Enjoy this new chapter in your life’s journey. 

[DrDistillation]

Thanks all,

stevea, I want to be careful in how I answer specific questions about them since a lot of what/how thing are done is not public.  I'll just say the IN complex has both column and pot stills in use. You may know they have another complex in KS where the bulk of the GNS, vodka and gins are distilled.  Besides just selling wholesale they do contract products as well and can pretty much handle your recipe and product any way you want it done.  With that said the bulk of product is done how you mentioned as it's usually the most economic way to produce these types of spirits.

LCP = Lincoln County Process.  Think Tennessee whiskey like Jack Daniels and their sugar maple charcoal process.  Wild Turkey is doing something similar to make their Longbranch whiskey using a mixture of mesquite and oak charcoals.  Keep in mind this isn't activated carbon but wood charcoal.  So by using the charcoal you get both a bit of cleanup from the charcoal for the new make as well as impart a taste from the wood itself.  So I'm enjoying playing with different woods such as apple, cherry, sugar maple, mesquit, hickory & oak.  I've been really surprised that we haven't seen more craft spirits made using simple techniques like this.  In industry this is being done two different ways at present, either with large vats using a drip through gravity technique the way JD does it or just adding spirits to a container holding said charcoal for X days then draining back off which is how Dickel steeps their whiskey.  They do this before barreling normally.  JD also does this again after barreling for Gentleman Jack (so it's double filtered, once before and once after the barrel).

I'm not a huge fan of TN whiskey but like the idea enough to play with it at home.  However my idea is not to run all spirit this way but only a portion say 5 to 10% via the charcoal then barrel/age as usual.  After the spirit matures you now have a bit more variety of spirits to blend with. Add in a touch of the mesquit aged spirit for a touch of Texas smoke.  Add in a bit of the maple aged spirit for a bit more sweetness, etc.  Basically, a way to add a bit of controlled complexity to the base spirit without drastically changing it, not unlike mixing in finish barrels of whiskey done in port or sherry casks.  I like subtle complexity, not over the top like TN whiskey. I like the idea of doing it during the barrel selection blend for control over how the spirit turns out.

[Foreshot]

Thanks for joining. It will be interesting to see your opinions on things.

19 minutes ago, DrDistillation said:

I've been really surprised that we haven't seen more craft spirits made using simple techniques like this.

That's a really good idea. I didn't think that the LCP would bring over flavor from the wood as it's turned to charcoal. Definitely something to experiment with. See, you've change craft distilling with a single post.

[Silk City Distillers]

Would love to get your thoughts on the basics even.  Who cares about the proprietary commercial stuff, I'd love to know what you think makes good whiskey.

 

[DrDistillation]

Foreshot,

For just R&D purposes a backyard fire pit or BBQ grill and a a tin can (never used empty paint can or cookie tin to 5 gallon metal bucket) with a small hole punched in the top works. Lots of videos on Youtube on how to do this.  Walmart sells "Western Premium BBQ Products Smoking Chips" in a range of wood types including apple, cherry, maple, mesquite & hickory and these seem to work well for R&D purposes and only about $3/bag or so that makes it easy to source for testing.  This is what I've been using.

Silk City Distillers,

Wow, not sure where to begin.  Purely talking basics and craft, I like a bit colder ferment than typical (8% to 9%), so it's done in roughly 5 to 7 days vs 3 days.  I prefer pure pot stilled whiskey over columns, doublers, thumpers or plates using a worm. I like a slow pot still spirit run (after fast stripping).  When I say slow, I mean probably 1/2 speed of what most people run. This allows for more natural refluxing as well as have more time for esterification to take place in the boiler which I think produces a better spirit. I like a generous cut (not super wide or narrow) to get the late heads and early tails which give the whiskey it's unique flavor that will develop as it ages.  Hell, I'd even barrel up late heads and early tails (separately) once in a while to use for back blending later after aging which can turn out spectacular on their own. I like rerunning feints with heavy oils skimmed off or separated.  I'd strip down to at least 10% on the strip run (adjust as needed) so that the spirit run ABV is just about perfect for aging without having to dilute.

I doubt there is anything new here.  I'd rather produce less product of higher quality and price it accordingly.

[Patio29Dadio]

Awesome information and ideas DrDistillation!

[Naked Spirits Distillery]

following along. Great info!

[stevea]

Wow - great stuff.  Thanks.   LCP - right - I don't often think of TN Whiskey, tho' I have some Dickel here somewhere.  It is diferent way to impart wood flavors.

 

 

[RBDistiller]

Welcome DrDistillation, look forward to hearing your input and learning from your years of experience.