Calcium crystallization inside of bottles?! Or something else

[dmacnz]

Hi,

I have had a strange problem: I am getting crystallisation inside of my bottle of spirits (45% abv). It looks like snowflakes inside of the bottle walls. It appears after 1-2 days after bottling.

I assume this is calcium from the "tap" water bottle rinse. I had issues in the past with a transparent white on the inner walls, Which I now think is probably from calcium. I have done a fair test and did not get any crystallisation if the bottles were rinsed with filter water, star-san, gin etc.
I have checked with the bottle supplier, and they have also not seen this issue before!

Does anyone how any ideas if I am on the right track? or could this be something else!

[Foreshot]

Can you tell us more about the spirit? Whiskey/Gin/Vodka? Production method - column, pot still? What kind of water did you use for proofing? The more details you can provide the better insight we can provide.

[kleclerc77]

A picture of of this phenomenon would go a long way as well.

[captnKB]

Hi @dmacnz There can be many sources of your crystals. Can you give me detail?

Need more info about what is going into the bottles and how it is made to provide feedback

[dmacnz]

Sorry, Guys,
Some more info.

Its Gin is made from neutral in a Column still, mostly macerated, 0nly some citrus and cardamom in the vapour basket.
with Pretty conservative cuts. (decent heads cut)
It is proofed with "filtered" (5 stage filter NON-RO) water to 45% after a few days of resting, (no signs of louching)
It seems that (what I am assuming is calcium) is coming out of solution and turning into a solid on the inside wall of the glass.
i have tested washing bottle with a mixture of different things without much luck.
It happens quick, in around one day, the "snowflakes" appear.

I had a similar problem with a white haze which would appear towards to top of the bottle previously. I think it may of been a similar issue!

I am leaning towards the water filter not being up for the job.

Any idea would be great.

Thanks

[Foreshot]

Possibly saponification. Do you do one shot proofing or do you slow proof? One shot proofing will increase the likelihood of saponification.

Buy distilled water for your next batch and see if that helps. I'm a firm believer that proofing water should only be distilled or RO water. It helps keep the flavor of the spirit. Water used for fermenting is a different story.

So I would say use better water and slow proof - no more than 5 proof/day, with 1-2 proof better.

[dmacnz]

9 minutes ago, Foreshot said:

Possibly saponification. Do you do one shot proofing or do you slow proof? One shot proofing will increase the likelihood of saponification.

Buy distilled water for your next batch and see if that helps. I'm a firm believer that proofing water should only be distilled or RO water. It helps keep the flavor of the spirit. Water used for fermenting is a different story.

So I would say use better water and slow proof - no more than 5 proof/day, with 1-2 proof better.

Thanks for the info. 
 

This was proofed around 10% per day. Around 3-4 days from 80 to 45%abv

I have pulled the RO filter out of the wraps and will give it a try also! 
lucky these were small batch recipe development runs. Just hoping this doesn’t happen in full production!! 
 

 

[JonDistiller]

If you shine a phone flashlight through it, do you see lots of small glitter points or does it continue to look like the above picture?

[dmacnz]

To add to my confusion. 
The batch of gin has a PH or 8.2! Which I'm surely isn’t helping! 
 

my NGS has a ph of 8.0. So I’m also perplexed  to why my final product is so alkaline!

On 6/4/2022 at 12:09 AM, JonDistiller said:

If you shine a phone flashlight through it, do you see lots of small glitter points or does it continue to look like the above picture?

It seems to continue as before. 


 

[dmacnz]

Just to follow up,

I did a small test batch using RO water for proofing. Looks to of solved the issue. Thanks to all who helped out with the info!!