Slow Death Filling out Forms... need a bit of help

[Ken]

Folks,

There is a question in the TTB forms that I'm not sure how to answer. I have two alembic pot stills, One 10 gallon and one 70 gallon. I have both set up with preheaters.

The form says "Stills (serial number, kind, capacity and intended use). The capacity shall be stated as the estimated maximum proof gallons of spirits capable of being produced every 24 hours, or (for column stills) may be represented by a statement of the diameter of the base and number of plates; and..."

How do I answer this given that most of the year, my still will collect dust. This is a farm distillery and a part time operation.

thanks for the help!

Ken

[grehorst]

Answer it as they ask it- estimate what would be the maximum you COULD produce. They use this information along with your payments to ensure you're staying honest. They don't actually hold you to producing this amount. When you get around to the bond, you will state your maximum production you intend to produce and store which will likely be much less than what you could produce.

A lot of the questions they ask may frustrate you but the TTB has it's reasons even though they may not seem reasonable or apparent to you. Don't let it get to you- if they don't like your answer they'll let you know it and give you the opportunity to correct it.

Good luck!

[ny_spirits]

Also don't be afraid to call the ttb. There are a few people there who can actually be very helpful. The more you can get right on the first go-round the better. But as Guy said, you will have a chance to correct everything they don't like at some point. I seem to dimly recall that we were able to submit a draft of our application to someone at ttb who took a quick look and made some comments before we even officially submitted our application for registration. If you don't have a contact at ttb yet, pm me and I will try to track down ours.

[absaroka]

I'll echo what everyone else has said in that the TTB is very helpful, probably the most helpful out of all the government agencies I've had to deal with. They are a little overwhelmed right now since they gave the DSP agents wine permits as of lately.... so be patient if they don't get back to you right away.

[delaware_phoenix]

The TTB was always nice on the phone, and usually I got someone knowledgeable. A couple times I could tell it was someone new, but they always tried to be helpful, even if that was referring me to the correct part of the regulations. The state, however, is opaque and often not very helpful.

The specific question is answered as though you are a 24/7 operation, even if you're not.

[Jonathan Forester]

The forms are a nuisance, but the best bet is to take every question at face value as to what you think will be the reality, or best case scenario, once you are up and running.

I agree with the others in that TTB is very helpful. this wasn't always the case. Right after the department took over from ATF after 9/11 they actively tried to talk me out of opening a distillery. And did. Now it's the opposite. I had a difficult question the other day. The person I spoke to didn't definitively know the answer and I needed rock solid info. They passed me to someone else, who then got in touch with the department head and physically asked them to make a decision, face to face, while I waited on the phone. Not on hold, but so I could actually hear the conversation.

[Ken]

Thank you all for your help. Took the advice and simply reached out to the TTB which I was a bit apprehensive to do. As a would be small producer I was worried I would be getting more grief than help. I am stunned to say, this appears to be a govt agency that actually helps. They emailed me a completed sample F5110.41. OK, so it wasnt as much help as I would have liked (wanted cut and paste!), but it tells me I was making these questions much harder than they were intended.

I will not submit until construction on the barn is complete in November. I will let you all know how I make out once I do submit. Of course, then there is the State of New York to contend with...... I still have to get fingerprinted!