Neil Posted January 2, 2013 Share Posted January 2, 2013 Hi all, I have some questions regarding pumps. If someone can shed some light on this, I would be grateful. Primarily, we need a pump to transfer GNS from drums. I have looked at older posts that recommend air powered diaphram pumps. Some of the comments recommeded Mc-Masters and I also recall seeing recommendations for a particular manufacturer called Graco. We contacted a sales rep who has a stainless steel graco pump with an added drum mount suction kit. The pump is a Saniforce 515 diaphragm pump but it is quite pricey ($2,300) Compared to the one's on the Mc-Master site, they are a quarter of the price but made from plastic. http://www.mcmaster.com/#diaphragm-transfer-pumps/=kv4wc3 How important is it to have a stainless steel pump verses plastic for a distillery? If the plastic ones from Mc-masters are cheaply made then perhaps it makes sense to spend the extra dough for the Graco? Also, there is another option which the sales rep suggested which is a Finish Thompson transfer pump with explosion proof motor. The Pump and motor come with a grounding wire kit. See below link http://www.finishthompson.com/assets/downloads/brochure_dp_all.pdf (see page 2) This option is $1700. However, it appears that the only application, unless I'm wrong is for drum transfer and we will still need to purchase a pump anyway for tranfer of spirits in and around the distillery, then it makes sense to pays to stick to the Graco with suction kit. If anyone has any first hand knowledge about this subject and some advise, we would greatly appreciat it. Thank you and Happy New Year to all you distillers out there. - Neil Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Absinthe Pete Posted January 2, 2013 Share Posted January 2, 2013 Lots of questions lately about pumps. My new years present to you all is some info. First off diaphragm pumps are recommended because they are explosion proof. Getting an explosion proof electric motor is expensive. Diaphragms are too if buying new. Next plastic pumps are fine if they are made out of ethanol tolerant material, most are. The only problem is the type of hose you have to use with ethanol is usually PP or PE and that is very stiff hose. So you'll have to use plastic threaded/barbs for the pump so they break, and they will break, instead of the pump body. Here's my present. EBAY PEOPLE!!!!!! EBAY!!!!! You can find 3/4" Diaphragm pumps Stainless Housing and Teflon Diaphragms for $300-$500. These are rebuildable. That means you buy if for cheap open it up and wash everything put it back together, add lube if it's required (on the air end of course) and pump till the cows come home. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
daveflintstone Posted January 2, 2013 Share Posted January 2, 2013 good advice. one question: are diaphragm pumps generally considered cip? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Absinthe Pete Posted January 2, 2013 Share Posted January 2, 2013 I don't think so they don't have enough pressure or volume. CIP pumps are specialized so they can handle heat and are extremely powerful. You could use a modified pressure washer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
daveflintstone Posted January 2, 2013 Share Posted January 2, 2013 Actually I meant can the pump itself be cleaned without taking it apart, I guess by pumping through it. That's how I clean my centrifugal pump. This may be a dumb question. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Absinthe Pete Posted January 3, 2013 Share Posted January 3, 2013 Yes, it can be. But when you buy something used you want to take it apart and make sure every surface is clean and free of contaminants. Once it's at that stage just run some water through it to clean it. Teflon cleans pretty easy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mendodistilling Posted January 3, 2013 Share Posted January 3, 2013 Air Diaphragm pumps also don't need expensive micro controllers. This is a huge cost and so is the remote systems, etc. The size of the pump dramatically increases cost too, so air is much cheaper, even w/ the compresser. The problem is that like anything using air you should use an inline oiler if you need to lube the motor I'd imagine. I've looked into these pumps cost wise but not whether they are like most air tools and require an oiler inline or a drop of oil from time to time. Air diaphragm pumps are gentler than other pumps as well so they are good for mutliuse around the base product production side of things. Carlsen and Assoc. Sells them for winery use, give them a call if for no other reason just to ask them what they suggest and why. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mendodistilling Posted January 3, 2013 Share Posted January 3, 2013 Not CIP - This one is a yamada, I almost got excited. http://www.ebay.com/itm/YAMADA-NDP-20BST-DOUBLE-DIAPHRAGM-INDUSTRIAL-PUMP-STAINLESS-STEEL-TEFLON-PTFE-/120957042735?pt=BI_Pumps&hash=item1c299a002f Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fldme Posted January 3, 2013 Share Posted January 3, 2013 You could use plastic, but ground it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Absinthe Pete Posted January 3, 2013 Share Posted January 3, 2013 You really don't want to ever use inline oilers. For one most diaphragm pumps use a special lubricant that you only need to use once or twice a year. Second inline oilers will make oil spit out of your exhaust on any air device you use and you DO NOT WANT aerosolized oil spraying around your liquor. What you want to do is use a very good water filter/water separator for your compressor so it doesn't spit water either. If you use an inline oiler you'll never be able to use that air hose for blowing things off as there will now be oil in it. Every air device can be manually oiled and there are very few modern air devices that need constant oiling, certainly nothing in this field. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mendodistilling Posted January 4, 2013 Share Posted January 4, 2013 Good advice, never thought it through that far. Just wanted to point out the lube part. Very good info though! What are the leading brands which make CIP pneumatic equipment? I know I see Yamada but I am going in email circles with their people about it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Absinthe Pete Posted January 4, 2013 Share Posted January 4, 2013 CIP doesn't need to be explosion proof unless you have open barrels near by with vapors seeping out, which you shouldn't anyway. By the time the still is drained you don't need an explosion proof motor. I would use an electric pump for CIP. CIP Pumps are specialized as I said before to handle heat and have the right amount of pressure and flow. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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