Single Malt on the grain ?

[Troy Smith]

I am planning on making a single malt whiskey that is fermented and distilled on the grain, instead of lautering it. I was wondering if anybody has produced a single malt this way and how did you like the results ?

[Telluride]

Have you figured out how you will dispose of your stillage after you have removed the alcohol? Seems like that could be quite the process. This is the reason why we lauter, I can throw the grains into trash cans and a farmer picks them up. I would also like to know how you plan on chilling the mash with grain in, it would have to be more of an inline chiller that ASD had shown. A plate chiller would clog, a jacketed fermenter might work to chill, but i would be concerned that it might take too long and the fact that you are grain in could definitely throw it through a bacterial infection, I've found even good lacto beers don't make a great whiskey, you don't get that nice barley flavor that you're looking for. The ideas of distilling a sour beer sounds like a great idea, I've made some incredible sour beer aged on ex whiskey oak before that is phenomenal, and yes when distilled it is a terrible whiskey. Have you done any smaller batches through your test still? Thats where I would start...

[Lenny]

I lauter as well, but really... on-grain single malt would be no different in process and equipment than what most use to produce a bourbon or rye, right? I mean, you won't be getting the temp as high with an all barley scarification rest so you can get away with a single infusion. Chilling would either be handled by a tube in tube chiller, or an immersion chiller (like a big ass plate or coil), or dumping a crap ton of ice into your hot mash.

As far as flavor goes... that's all you. Gotta say though, I really dig the idea of shaking up what most know a malt whiskey to be and going grain-in is one way to do that.

Telluride - we're heading down to see you as soon as it starts dumping.

[Troy Smith]

I pump the stillage into large plastic containers and then drain it and farmers will pick up the grains, I do corn this way. My mash cooker has a cooling jacket that is connected to a 30 ton water chiller, so I'm pretty sure I can cool it down quick enough, the cooling jacket on the fermenter is also connected to the water chiller. My small still isn't hooked up anymore, but your right that would be the best place to start.

[Silk City Distillers]

The obvious benefit of this approach is increased yield. Near 100% conversion rates with little loss of starch, sugar, or alcohol.

[Shindig]

Troy

After you pump it into a container how do you draw the water out?

[Dave Rigo]

Troy in my opinion you can do on grain fermentation successfully with single malt. We mill to a flour consistency when we make vodka and bourbon. However with single malt you merely want to crack the grain. The reason you do this is to avoid heavy fusel oils that can build if the husks are ground up with the barley seed. You probably only need 80 to 90% of your typical whiskey grain bill in weight as you will get a slightly better conversion. Hope this helps...

[Troy Smith]

Shindig-- The container has a large valve with a screen that I just open, it takes awhile but most of the water will drain out.

[Troy Smith]

Dave Rigo-- Thanks, that's great information.

[jeffw]

I'd love to better understand Mr. Rigo's advice. If grain will all be in the still for the spirit run, why does it matter how it is milled. You are not leaving any part of the grain behind depending on you milling. I would think that once the still hits a high enough temperature, whatever fusel oils are present in any part of the grain they are going to be extracted. What am I missing?

Cheers,
Jeff

[TylerPederson]

One method you could use to reduce fusel oils is to double distill your whiskey, and dilute your low wines prior to the spirit run to encourage a phase separation. Diluting your low wines to 30% abv or less 24 hours prior to the spirit run will cause many of the fatty acids and heavier oils to float to the top of your holding tank. Simply draw out from the bottom of the tank, leaving the oil slick behind.

This practice is briefly covered in Whiskey: Technology, Production and Marketing. Here is a link to the pages discussing phase separation:

http://books.google.com/books?id=AwF0AwAAQBAJ&pg=PA168&lpg=PA168&dq=phase+separation+whisky&source=bl&ots=zbb73mf4LU&sig=Kb9rWmm-zp7nV4XK9L8GKzV-VbY&hl=en&sa=X&ei=7c5bVPOjKcmBiwKO5IGYCA&ved=0CCsQ6AEwAQ#v=onepage&q=phase%20separation%20whisky&f=false

I imagine that milling the malt increases the extraction of fusel oils during the distillation process, much the same way that milling increases the availability of starches during the mashing process. The milling process simply makes it more accessible. If this wasn't the case, everybody is wasting a lot of time and money on milling.

[P.T. Wood]

I have been doing this for a few years and love the results give me a call if you want some details on our process. (My whiskey is more a single distillery multi malt)

Cheers,

P.T.

719 239 0222