Controlling proof with a hybrid still.

[Corey Smith]

   When making whiskey, my SOP (has been) to strip 6 fermenters which gives me about 150 gallons of low wines at around 45% ABV which fills the still. I then do a spirit run through the 4 plate column. Once all plates are have been refluxing for 20 minutes, I lower the defleg temp to allow vapor to start passing. The initial heads start at around 183 proof, drop relatively quicky to 179(ish), and hover there for a long time, then very very slowly drop to 160, then drops pretty quickly to 120. Now it (was) my understanding that we could not collect anything off the parrot above 160. I now understand that it's the collected hearts that must be under 160. From my taste/smell, the hearts seem to begin near the 178 proof range (begins to be very sweet, light, even sippable). Needless to say, my hearts yield has been very low at about 1/2 of the heads volume.

   If I were to start collecting hearts when I think the heads are done (178ish proof), at the slow pace that the proof drops, I can't believe the combined proof would be under 160, so I have a few questions, and please, I'm very open to any advise.

1- Am I refluxing too much? Should I turn a plate or 2 off, or open the defleg more for more flow?

2- What proof range are others cutting to heads at (running a similar setup)?

3- Should my initial charge be a lower ABV?

   I'd love to know what a typical run looks like for others running a hybrid still...

 

Corey

[Silk City Distillers]

Hearts yield of half your heads yield?  That doesn't make sense, even remotely.

Try turning off reflux entirely after you collect heads, and turning back on as you approach tails.  Some folks call this approach heads and tails compression.

Cut based on flavor, not proof or vapor temperature (the same thing).

You will find it very hard to collect below 160 if you are doing strip/spirit on 4 plates for the whole run.  On my still, with that same process, it's difficult for me to get below 180 proof.

You can run a 3-4 plates single pass and make a great whiskey, a lot of folks here do that.

 

[Kindred Spirits]

I typically recommend clients charge the boiler at around 40 %abv just to ensure you aren't cutting down on your heating surface at the end of the runs and greatly reduces the potential for getting close to running the equipment dry.

What you could try doing if you want to keep the abv down is use the plated column to "compress" the heads, and then once you have them pulled off, switch over to pot still mode for the hearts, then recompress for the tails.

Almost the same thing as what silk said, except it will drop the ABV a bit more and allow the column to cool a little bit to aid in the tails compression. Main thing is, total collected run has to be below 160. I also second @Silk City Distillers remark about cutting by taste not proof or temp. Too many people want a hard number to make cuts at, but it's called the "art" of distilling for a reason.

You will get a little more smearing when it comes time to make the tails cut, but it shouldn't be an issue since you have the much larger window due to the strip/finish method. Once you start getting hints of tails, recompress and get the last bit of hearts out.

[Pofarmer]

Just a question. I'm learning too here.  Anyway. What size column are you running and what is your approximate output rate off the column? Are you tracking dephleg water temperature?

[Corey Smith]

I have a 10 inch column. Flow rate has been approx 6 gal per hour. I do track the deflector temp (not religiously)...

[JustAndy]

I have a lot of experience running whiskey on a 4 plate hybrid still. 

40% charge strength is too high for making whiskey. Running the strips without plates or reflux should give you a low wines around 25-30%. If the low wines are above 30% you should dilute them down before the 2nd distillation. At a charge strength of ~30% you don't need to engage plates or reflux, although it can be useful to engage some towards the tails. If you want to do the spirits run with reflux and plates engaged you should dilute down to a charge strength around 20%. My experience is if you compress and remove the heads of a 2nd distillation you will end up with uninteresting whiskey that ages poorly. If you are going to run with active reflux condenser (dephelg) you need to track the temperature of the water in, water out, still head below dephelg and still head/lyn after dephelg to understand what you are doing. 

Everything is different if you want to run it as a single pass whiskey. It can work for making whiskey but it requires more fiddling than many would like to do which is why most people end up stripping and double distilling. 

[Pofarmer]

21 hours ago, JustAndy said:

I have a lot of experience running whiskey on a 4 plate hybrid still. 

40% charge strength is too high for making whiskey. Running the strips without plates or reflux should give you a low wines around 25-30%. If the low wines are above 30% you should dilute them down before the 2nd distillation. At a charge strength of ~30% you don't need to engage plates or reflux, although it can be useful to engage some towards the tails. If you want to do the spirits run with reflux and plates engaged you should dilute down to a charge strength around 20%. My experience is if you compress and remove the heads of a 2nd distillation you will end up with uninteresting whiskey that ages poorly. If you are going to run with active reflux condenser (dephelg) you need to track the temperature of the water in, water out, still head below dephelg and still head/lyn after dephelg to understand what you are doing. 

Everything is different if you want to run it as a single pass whiskey. It can work for making whiskey but it requires more fiddling than many would like to do which is why most people end up stripping and double distilling. 

So, in trying to do a "One and done" single pass whiskey with a 4 plate column my MO has been to run to compress heads, and then back off power to where all the plates are good and active and then adjust dephleg to where I'm around 125 proof off the parrot, and adjust dephleg to keep that as long as I can. I'm not tracking any temps at this time. Heads taken off will wind up being less than 10% of the total run.  Does this sound sort of right?

[JustAndy]

It is not how I do it but there are many different ways to do it so I couldn't say. Are you happy with the results? To me that seems like a pretty low proof to be distilling single pass at and like it would be very tailsy. 

[Pofarmer]

We're just putting some in barrels now.  Small volume. I'm going to do some double Pot still to compare, I think. I don't know that I'd necessarily call it tailsy.  How do you prefer to do it?