RyeWater

I am trying to put together an excel spread sheet that calculates the exact cost of producing a particular spirit based on inputting current material / resource costs and I am having a little trouble calculating the cost of energy for a run.

What I am trying to do is take into account:

Cost of Grain

Cost of Yeast

Cost of Water

Cost of Energy

Cost of Enzymes

Cost of Misc

The cost of energy aspect of this equation seems to be a tricky one. Does anyone out there have any idea of how I could calculate the amount of energy per gallon it takes to distill a wash using a steam jacketed pot still.

Does anyone have any idea of where I should start tackling this problem.

Thanks,

Tyler

Thanks I am looking into these now.

Ive been looking for a cheap still to do some formula testing on and was wondering if a 10 gallon alembic still like this has any real use. IE if i took the same wash and put it in this and made proper cuts would the spirit taste similar if I put that same wash into a 250 gallon pot still.

We are trying to locate a few suppliers to price out quality distillers grains for our distillery (Wheat/Malted Wheat, Rye/Malted Rye, Corn, Malted Barley)

http://www.countrymaltgroup.com/ is one that I have seen on this site but there must be more out there!

"So once I cool down the mash in the mashing vessel and pump it over to the fermenter it is beneficial to agitate the mash in the fermenter as long as I do not do it so vigorously that I disturb the surface and drawl O2 into the mash?"

Pumping and splashing should inject enough oxygen back in. There's way's to measure O2 but I've never seen anyone bother other than to satisify curiosity. Don't splash while hot though. Get it below 85f to be safe.

"Or are you saying that once fermentation begins it is best to not agitate it at all anymore for risk of drawling in O2,"

Agitate from the bottom all you want, nice and smoothly. If it's a closed vessel it's going to have a Co2 blanket formed on top so don't worry. If it's open, then just don't break the surface or cause it to 'roll' the surface under.Rolling will take surface oxygen down with it.

For time, I've seen yeast start in 2 hours if all things are right.

Do some small 5-10 gallon batches if you're worried. Temp and variety of yeast are the 2 largest variables. Get the specs from the yeast supplier. For common yeasts 68-72 is perfect. Higher will give off flavors, colder just goes dormant or slows way down.

You'll get the best info from a wine/beer supply shop if you have one locally who knows what they are doing. They do the exact same thing, just smaller quantities.

Thanks alot that clears things up for me. If you were fermenting a mash for like 4.5 days how often would you agitate it? IE like 3x a day for a hour each?

Thanks again everyone

Agitating to keep sugars/fermentables suspended is great, but only in primary fermentation. You just don't want to break the surface and introduce oxygen to the mash once active fermentation starts. True beer specialists don't want to introduce oxygen into fresh wort until it cools. Realize if you boil water you are removing the oxygen, so introducing it back in when cooled down is do-able, until fermentation starts. Then just stir it up smoothly. Same holds true for wine/brandy makers during primary fermentation.

Great answer thanks! I am a little confused on a couple things though and want to make sure I understand. So once I cool down the mash in the mashing vessel and pump it over to the fermenter it is beneficial to agitate the mash in the fermenter as long as I do not do it so vigorously that I disturb the surface and drawl O2 into the mash? Or are you saying that once fermentation begins it is best to not agitate it at all anymore for risk of drawling in O2, if so how long after I cool the mash down in the mashing vessel and pump it over to the ferm. does the fermentation process start?

thanks alot.

I have been trying to decide if adding agitators to each ferminator is worth the added cost. Most things I read say not to agitate the mash during the fermenting process but I cant help but notice that a lot of people are using fermentation vessels with agitators. Are there any benefits to agitate the mash during the fermenting process like increased ABV, faster ferment, superior product, etc?

Thanks,

Tyler

Tyler,

There are ways to knock down foaming allowing you to maximize your still charge. But ignoring that, you may want to consider a continuous stripping still at that volume. 500 gallons in a 2 gpm stripping still is only 4+ hours of machine time. Buy 3-500g fermenters, run out 3 stripping runs in a single long day (quicker than you can do in a batch still) and you have a lot more product to run through the finishing still.

Food for thought.

Cheers,

John

I had not done much looking to continuous stills at all. Could you recommend any manufacturers that make a decent product at a decent price? If i run all my wash in 1 day what am I going to do the rest of the week!

My plan was to get 3 or 4 500g ferms, 1 500g stripper and like a 150gal finisher.

Hey there, tried to get back to you about the internship but your account doesnt seem to accept PM's. email me at tysp22@gmail.com please!

Want to move to Hawaii? I am losing my intern in December

Messaged you!

Hey there, I am 6 months into the research phase of distilling and starting a distillery and am hoping to get some hands on experience working in an distillery. I did attend the Cornell Distilling workshop in NY a couple weeks ago and got some good experience but I would love to get a month or two of hands on time in a distillery.

I am knowledgeable of the terms and equipment and have read all the literature i can find on distilling so I am by no means a total novice. I will pull my weight and dont mind doing some of the grunt work. If you need some web help I can also do some HTML web design. I am 24 and a college grad with a business admin degree. If you can find me a place to stay that would be a huge bonus! Let me know if youre interested and I can provide my resume or more information!

I am in the process of deciding what fermenters and what mashing vessel I am going to purchase and I have looked into a whole slew of designs and manufacturers. I am looking for what everyone is, a high quality fermenter at a low qulaity pirce ! Understanding this is not reality I have two questions.

1. What are some specs/features that I want to make sure the fermenters have. I already know that I am looking for high grade stainless steel (anyone know what grades to look for) and a jacketed system for heating and cooling and i would like each ferm to have an agitator but what are some other specs that I should make sure the tank has that some tanks might not include.

2. My second question being does anyone have any good recommendations as to a distributor who makes a quality product at a good price point. I have contacted Newlands systems, Raynox, Glacier tanks, as well as a slew of Chinese manufacters from that alibaba website some of which seemed to produce crap, some of which seemed to have decent products.

I am no the fence if it is worth trying to buy chineese to save a few thousand bucks or to just by american/canadian and pay almost double but know its a good quality product.

Long and short of it, what do i want to make sure my ferms have and where is the cheapest place to get those things.

Thanks so much,

Tyler

I am in the process of deciding what size still and ferms. to purchase.

I am going to get a stripping still and then a finishing still.

I plan on fermenting whole grain mash (not sieving out the cracked grains) in my stripping still which i heard can create more foam so my question is if i get a 500 gallon ferm. and a 500 gallon stripping still would i be able to load the full 500 gallons of mash into the stripping still or would i only be able to load like 400 or 450 because of the foaming issue?

Thanks for any advice!

Tyler