Silk City Distillers

Do you have any additional water analysis/test results you can share? The report includes some detail about the items they are required to report, but doesn't include the basics. It should include elements like Alkalinity, Carbonate, Bicarbonate, Chloride, Sulfate, Calcium etc. You might want to ask the local water authority for a more comprehensive report.

If not, you might want to spend a few dollars to have the water tested by a company that specializes in doing water tests for brewing. There are plenty of top quality labs that have a really cost effective program for home brewers that would work just fine. It should probably cost less than $50 with shipping the sample to them.

I wouldn't do anything until I knew the exact numbers. Depending on the level of "Hardness" and specifically where the hardness is coming from, it might not be a big enough problem to warrant a softener. In some cases, if your sodium is high, and your "hardness" isn't very hard at all, you are going to create an even bigger problem by stripping out what you need, and replacing it with what you don't. (This is focused on mashing and fermentation, not product dilution).

A good book on the topic is Water: A Comprehensive Guide for Brewers by Palmer and Kaminski. While you wait you can peruse some of Palmer's free material: http://howtobrew.com/book/section-3/understanding-the-mash-ph/what-kind-of-water-do-i-need

Depends on the gravity of your sugar wash and potential alcohol post fermentation, but 20 gallons of 80abv seems unrealistic, you likely won't have that much alcohol, before cuts.

Check your local codes before you assume that a hydronic boiler or water heater requires any less scrutiny than a steam boiler. Many jurisdictions draw the line based on the input BTU of the appliance, not the fact that it is hot water or steam. Ever wonder why you see so many boilers and on-demand hot water heaters of 399,000 BTU? The funny number is due to the fact that those juridictions draw the line at 400,000 BTU. IBC 302.1.1 for example.

We had zero issues with our steam boiler installation, I'm sure the same scrutiny would have been applied for a similar sized electric or hydronic boiler.

Talked to the guys at Vincent Corporation a few months back, they make some smaller dewatering screw presses. They will rent out a trial unit, which I thought was a good idea, or you can ship down a drum for them to try out. It's a different dewatering approach, as an LSS is a decanter centrifuge and the Vincent CP units are screw presses. However, they were very concerned about dewatering effectiveness post-distillation, and even they thought the centrifuge would be the right approach.

If you could make an LSS half the size, and for half the cost, you'd own the market.

I understand the benefit of a pre-heater, but why not just use your existing fermenter coils or jacket and skip the additional tank? Dollar for dollar, and square footage, I'll take another fermenter over a warming tank.

Based on your batch sizes, just make sure you can strip twice in one day - emptying a full fermenter in two batch strips, and pre-heating the next. As long as you can pre-heat and hold the temperature, 20 horsepower should be more than enough power do to both strips in an 8 hour shift.

Very seriously consider the microbiological implications of batch pre-heating your mash. If you can not achieve high enough temperatures to reduce the growth of non-yeast bacteria, you will likely be creating an environment that favors bacteria over yeast. You will likely not be a happy camper if you pre-heat the mash to luke warm, and then wait a few days to strip.

Also, use the heat exchanger output water for pre-heating, don't move the vapor around like that. What happens when you run out of cooling capacity? On second thought, scrap your pre-heat tank design, it probably will not work. Also, why does your preheat tank have a dephlegmator on it?

Also, if that cooling coil in the mash tun is anywhere to scale, your are going to have a really long day, or days, to mash.

Alcohol stored at less than flammable levels?

I think most folks asking about DSI or coils are retrofitting an existing tank.

Creative Enzymes maybe? Their named seemed to pop up pretty often when I was looking for some atypical enzymes.

Jackets win over DSI and Coils, but if you are going to use your jacket for dual duty of heating and cooling, you better be sure it's designed to handle the thermal stresses of rapid cooling.

I could easily see a dimple jacket failing prematurely due to fatigue In fact, most manufacturers will tell you that unless you've informed them of thermal shock being a requirement, they aren't going to warranty the tank or jacket at all.

15.5hp cast iron - 265 gallon/1000l still capacity (insulated) - about a 30-40 minute heat up depending on which way the wind blows. On heat up, the boiler runs full out, but once we're into a run, the steam usage is minimal (2-3psig) - we rarely exceed 5 psig.

Between DSI and Coils for a mash tank, in my book DSI wins. Cleanup is easier with DSI, no mixing dead spots with DSI, retrofit/fab on an existing tank is much easier when you don't need to deal with condensate return on the coils. DSI is also going to be more efficient, as long as you keep the steam fully condensing in the tank.

The downside to DSI - big culinary steam filters are expensive, and you need to be using compatible chemicals, pretreat and use no chemicals at all (cue boiler additive distributor outrage).

Culinary grade steam is regularly used in food manufacture, in direct food contact and in food cooking. If it can be used in this application, which has a much higher level of scrutiny (you are eating what's coming out of the boiler), I don't see how mashing with DSI could be considered problematic ... if you follow a similar protocol. Also consider that the fermented mash will be going through an additional distillation stage, eliminating any non-volatiles or particulates introduced.

You need to check what the maximum solids diameter is for that particular model. Flapper valve models tend to be able to pass significantly larger solids than ball/seat valves.

Why not just have someone else manufacture your product under contract and focus on building your brand? Why even bother with the real estate and manual labor involved when someone else probably has better economies of scale?

The still represents a small fraction of your startup budget, maybe slightly more once you factor in mashing equipment, fermenters, and pumps. You would likely still face all the same buildout costs as a distillery, because you will be handling bulk spirit. From an authority/jurisdiction perspective, you might still be exposed to all the same budget-busting expenses as everyone else sprinklers, building and fire code gotchas, multi-month expense payments while awaiting licensing, etc etc.

Anyone using a filter press for dewatering after on-grain distillation? If so, what maker and your thoughts on how effective it is.

An alternative is to inject CO2 or Nitrogen (cheaper) from the bottom to rouse the yeast. Simple triclamp hose adapter and a check valve on the output should do just fine. If you want something to function on a timed basis, just use a solenoid and a timer. Shouldn't take any more than a few second burst every hour to keep the contents in suspension/mixing.

I am not an architect, engineer, and most certainly am not a lawyer.

Read up on the differences between NEC Class 1 and Class 2. In addition, if you have state variations of the IBC and IFC, search them for references to combustible dust being a trigger for high hazard (H2) occupancy. I've seen versions table 307 that list Combustible Dust as physical hazard. Lastly, review required fire rating between groups/occupancies/incidental use. Could be any number of things.

It's a stretch, but I'd also check your local codes for recs and guidance around how other high dust uses are handled (woodworking shops are sometimes very clearly spelled out).

I would say the typical argument is that you aren't generating enough dust to represent a hazard or that would require a separation.

You might want to check with your suppliers to see if they can provide cracked or milled grain. Run the numbers. What's the payback on the equipment, labor, maintenance, and construction costs? It might not be worth your time or money to mill.

I'd really like to know if folks with relatively decent municipal water are having success with the newer nano filtration systems.

I probably ran into you at Absolutely Fish... All my water chemistry and purification knowledge is from reef aquaria. We are actually still using my old Air Water Ice Reefkeeper RO/DI. The small production high rejection filters tend to deal better with lower waste flow, but the high production units really start to jump TDS fast if you slow the waste. These things used to be so expensive that you worried about ruining the membrane with lower flow, but now they are so cheap it doesn't pay to waste the water.

Seeing that your avatar has a picture of you tig welding.

Consider re-purposing a stainless basket filter/strainer. You have 80% of what you need when you run it in reverse (vapor in the exit port, vapor out the inlet port). You may need to rework the basket for a finer mesh, but some perforated stainless sheet might get you close to a good end result. Second to that might be a bag filter housing if you can fashion a basket.

Branding Iron? There are plenty of makers of brands for wood burning, just google it and half a dozen will come up. Big custom brands can get very expensive though, and the size will be limited (modern brands use electric heaters, not fire).

Some of the barrel manufacturers do laser burning of logos, this will probably be much more cost effective than getting a large brand made.

Small ribbon that is inserted down the condenser tube to force turbulent flow. Sometimes folks use this approach to eek a little bit more efficiency or headroom out of a heat exchanger.

No relation, I just grabbed a google link, but they look like this:

http://phinneytool.com/your-source-for-turbulators/

If it's a liebig, putting a turbulator down into the top of the condenser tube can help as well.

Commonly called 'huffing' in the hobby community, typically seen with single tube in shell Leibig condensers. Sometimes due to the geometry of the condenser, where the vapor path is too narrow for the vapor speed, and especially if the coolant is very cold, or the angle not allowing fast enough drain off. Creates a kind of resonance where the vapor rapidly condenses, the condenser sucks air in to make up for the volume, the air is purged and as vapor refills the condenser it rapidly crashes again. In mild situations it'll show up as a slight wavering in the take off speed. Usually poor condenser design but sometimes due to blowing through very cold coolant at too high a flow rate.

If it is actually uncondensed vapor, do not run this equipment until you get the problem fixed or adjust your operating method to avoid it.

One more comment, someone passed this nugget of info on to me, so I'll share it here.

Feints from a pot still are a different animal than feints from a plated or packed column still. Due to the nature of the tighter fractionation with plates or packing, the concentration of congeners is higher. So while recycling feints from a pot still might have merit, due to the inefficiency of a pot still, recycling feints from a plated or packed still may not. In most cases, if you were to try it, you'd find that it will probably require a specialized still, that can provide even higher levels of separation than your spirit still, and I'd wager a bet that you'll need to take off at azeo to get something usable.

I realized after I posted most people would not answer this question due to the apparent risk. I guess I asked for this.

How about if I rephrase the question, taking it out of practice and application but more of a theoretical question:

Ethanol-water solutions above 50% are flammable and can cause an explosion if there is an ignition source and sufficient oxygen. Neither of these exist in a properly designed still. So, I'm at a loss as to how an explosion could occur.

Actually, Ethanol/Water concentrations of 20% are flammable at these temperatures. The fire point of 20% ethanol/water is 136F. Lower yet they will still easily flash and sustained burn given the right temperatures (wine in a searing hot pan). However, your argument is a valid one. Regardless of the wash alcohol concentration, the gases in the head space and column of a still don't typically represent any kind of stoichiometric mixture. To use an engine analogy, it's too rich to burn, too much fuel.

The lower explosive limit (LEL) of ethanol is 3.3% and the upper explosive limit (UEL) is 19%. It's pretty much a given that ethanol vapor in a still would be above the lower explosive limit in nearly every case and very likely above the upper explosive limit, in nearly every case (catastrophic failure aside). This would even apply to a pot still filled with a wash, not even a spirit run.

Frankly, I'd look at it from an entirely different position. What would happen in this situation if the still boiler were to fail, and the still was to dump the entirety of it's contents? A weld, a ferrule, a seam, flange, clamp, rivet, valve, etc, etc. In a situation where you were loaded with a wash or beer, it would probably be ugly, but in the case where you were loaded with high proof, it would probably be a disaster. There are so many ways this can fail. Imagine looping a hose around a triclamp valve and accidentally tugging at it, perfectly real scenario. Are you going to charge a still drain spraying out hot alcohol to try to shut it off?

High temp high concentration ethanol spilled will immediately create a vapor cloud, and chances are, it's going to be between the LEL/UEL. The higher the temperature, the lower the flash points, flame points, and the higher the speed of vaporization (given a fixed concentration). I cringe when I hear about guys doing spirit runs on a direct fire still. If the boiler were to fail, the operator and nearly everyone in the general vicinity would die.

All that said, I wouldn't bother, by loading the boiler at such high proof you are gaining, at best, the equivalent of one additional plate. Going from 4 to 5 plates to try to squeeze a neutral out of your feints isn't going to make any real difference. In fact, you could get exactly the same output running your still will a lower ABV boiler charge, slower take off rate, with a higher reflux ratio (higher dephlegmator flow rate or lower dephlegmator temperature overall). There is nothing that 5 plates can do that 4 plates run at a higher reflux ratio can't do (No, really, the operating conditions have a large overlap).

You should easily be able to hit 185 on a 4 plate with a 40% boiler charge. But it won't be anywhere near neutral or clean.