ebstauffer Posted June 3, 2015 Share Posted June 3, 2015 To date we have produced both our peated and unpeated single malt spirit by making wort in a traditional "beer-for-drinking" method -- add crushed grain to mash tun, sach rest, drain, sparge. We've partnered with a near-by brewer using his brewhouse as our cooker doesn't have a false-bottom. Wanted to see if anyone here has done a methodology comparison between a "scotch style" lautered mash (wort?) and a grain-in mash using the same grain, yeast, and fermentation. Frankly it's a bit of a pain to haul the grain to the brewhouse, mash, transfer to totes, cool, then haul them back and transfer to a fermenters. The brewer is a bit reluctant to let us use his chiller / hose as the wort is (obviously) never boiled. Fair enough I suppose. Thoughts? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NEPA-still-chillin Posted June 4, 2015 Share Posted June 4, 2015 Good question, I've recently done a batch that i malted, sun dried and then half-ass roasted and did the traditional lauter style. I currently don't have any barley in house to try a grain-in style but that should change in a week or two Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MSWDistiller Posted June 4, 2015 Share Posted June 4, 2015 Why is your brewer reluctant to use his chiller or hoses for lautered wort? I am a former brewer and get my wash from my former brewery. I get the wash up to 80C to sterilize it before knockout. Even if I didn't I don't know why it would matter. The brewer should sterilize KO lines either way. If they really have a concern they could run a reverse heat exchange with hot caustic afterwards (which they should be doing regularly anyways). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ebstauffer Posted June 4, 2015 Author Share Posted June 4, 2015 I assume (but havent asked) that he would prefer not to have unsanitized wort go through the chiller -- they're not exactly pleasant to clean. You really don't want to denature the enzymes; you want them to keep chugging along converting every spec of starch to sugar. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MSWDistiller Posted June 5, 2015 Share Posted June 5, 2015 Is your brewer's logic: No boil, no hot break = greater fouling in heat exchanger? I'm not sure I follow that logic. I'm just trying to give you ammunition. I know brewers do not like to do things that are different just because they are different. If you ask them for a reason you might get them to bend. Maybe I am off on this but if you mash properly then you will maximize starch conversion. Not mashing off and leaving enzymes wont help too much. Residual sugar from mashing is typically in the form of limit dextrins. Naturally occurring malt amylases do not handle them very well. You can use exogenous enzymes (limit dextrinase) in your fermenter that will break down the limit dextrins much more efficiently for a minimal cost. Also if you do not sterilize your wash you will have a less controlled fermentation. Which may not be a bad thing but it will not be as reproducible. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ebstauffer Posted June 5, 2015 Author Share Posted June 5, 2015 I dont know of anyone who boils their mash ( or at least brings to 170F after sach rest). Am I missing something here? Obviously I do when cereal mashing but I certainly dont with malted (or raw) rye/wheat/barley/etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jay Posted June 8, 2015 Share Posted June 8, 2015 We haven't lautered but we've mad about 5 different single malts all grain-in. They're testing very well in the tasting room. I would cut your brewer out of the picture and bring everything in house. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeteB Posted June 8, 2015 Share Posted June 8, 2015 It should be possible to make a nice single malt with grain in, and I assume a column still. But it is unlikely to taste like a regular lautered Scotch made in an alembic pot still. One difference will be caused by boiling the husk in the still. Scottish distilleries keep their mash below 160 F, at higher temperatures a lot of unwanted flavour is leached from the husk. ...................... boils their mash ............................. Obviously I do when cereal mashing but I certainly dont with malted (or raw) rye/wheat/barley/etc. I don't understand what you mean, rye/wheat/barley are cereals Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jeffw Posted June 9, 2015 Share Posted June 9, 2015 The boiling the husk is an interesting thought. I have thought of that from the beer side of things of never lautering over 170. That said, bourbon is already made grain in with barley with no problem. Of course, the barley content is pretty low. I will be making my first stab at grain-in single malt next week, so I guess I shall see. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ebstauffer Posted June 10, 2015 Author Share Posted June 10, 2015 Very good point about the husk -- no lack of "boiling husk == astringency" comment in the brewing fora. We do in fact use a 4-tray column but only stack them for heads compression and to hold back the tails. I'll see if I can regrind our crushed malt into somethign resembling flour and run a test batch. Thanks for all the thoughts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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