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Mashbill in pounds

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So how do you calculate how much water? i get the 2lbs grain per gallon. But lets say you want to make a 600 gallon mash. how much strike water to start with? if you start by heating 600 gallons then you add 1200lbs of grain , you will have much more than 600 total gallons in that tank. in the brewers world there are calculators for this. i have not found one for mashing corn, rye and barley. Am i missing something?

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On 8/22/2018 at 8:50 AM, Georgeous said:

So how do you calculate how much water? i get the 2lbs grain per gallon. But lets say you want to make a 600 gallon mash. how much strike water to start with? if you start by heating 600 gallons then you add 1200lbs of grain , you will have much more than 600 total gallons in that tank. in the brewers world there are calculators for this. i have not found one for mashing corn, rye and barley. Am i missing something?

I had the same question, my plan was to add grain and warm/hot water simultaneously with a flow meter on the water, then cook it with the steam jacket. That way, in the future, if it is better to add your grain to a certain amount of water, you will know the amount. From what I understand, there is no harm in steeping then cooking as opposed to getting the water to temp then adding grain(correct me if I'm wrong!!). Best of luck.

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This is a very rough calculation and the number will vary widely based on grain grind and mash bill 

on average for me a 100 pounds of grain cooked takes up the water volume of 12 gallons.

50 gallons of water

100 pounds of grain 

Yields about 62 gallons of mash

Some volume will be lost to vapor if you are bringing your mash to a boil

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so let me ask it like this, i have a 600 gallon mash tun. i am told the standard for a 10% wash is 2lbs per gallon. That said i will need 1200lbs of grain correct? now with a quarts per pound ration of 1.25  that will require 375 gallons of water 

according to rackers.org can i mash it, my 600 gallon fermenter can handle 1500 lbs of grain and at 1:25 qts/lb i will have a 588 gallon capacity. now the question is. What would target OG be of that mash? 

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Depends on the grain being mashed and your overall mash efficiency.  If you are talking corn, with solid mash efficiency, maybe 1.13 or 1.14.  Keep in mind that's more than 3 pounds a gallon ...  not a fun mash.

 

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On ‎8‎/‎29‎/‎2018 at 4:01 PM, Silk City Distillers said:

Depends on the grain being mashed and your overall mash efficiency.  If you are talking corn, with solid mash efficiency, maybe 1.13 or 1.14.  Keep in mind that's more than 3 pounds a gallon ...  not a fun mash.

 

So before my 600 gallon system i was doing a 75/21/4 ~ corn/rye/barley on a smaller 50 gallon system. My background in mashing came from the brewing industry where we mashed at 150°F for 60-90 minutes. i used promash to calculate my mashes. so now that i have moved into the big boy world i am having issues scaling with this. Knowing this grain ratio, having it hammer milled, and wanting a target of 600 gallons:
1. what specific gravity should i target? previously i been targeting 1.076 OG after mash to get to a 10%ABV after fermentation

2. What do most of you target for your mash for whiskeys

3. How would you design this above? Promash and Beer Smith is for Beer. Is there something similar for Distilling. i use HoochWare and they have a recipe section but no calculators to help me with mash design. In beer we did not mash corn only grains. there is a grain entry in promash for flaked maize, flaked rye, and flaked barley; is that the same for target specific gravity calculations?

4. See my attached screenshot from promash based on 3lbs per gallon with these potential specific gravities at 75% brewhouse efficiencies i should be at 11%ABV

Any help advice would be greatly appreciated

 

BourbonRecipe.PNG.9059087f69c471568d828c71b41feb6c.PNG

 

 

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so according to https://www.rackers.org/calcs.shtml 's can i mash it, this will not fit in my 600 gallon mash tun at 1.25 qt/lb . 1800lbs of grain at 1 qt/lb would require 594 gallon mash tun capacity. A grain in mash is thick, will it be ok to do 1 qt/lb???

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Georgeous - The American whiskey industry uses the term "beer gallons" to describe mash thickness for grain-in fermentation and distillation of things like corn, rye, wheat and malt. The reason for this, is most equipment and process can handle one level of mash thickness, and scaling up or down or comparing yields from plant to plant or recipe to recipe is much easier done this way. 

A beer gallon is the total volume of liquid per bushel. Big distilleries typically run a 28 to 35 gallon beer. We run a 30 gallon beer, and hit a starting gravity around 1.065.

So, for 500 gallons of finished mash, we start with 16 and 2/3rds bushels. This is important as bushels are a measure of volume, not weight, and we are working in volumes here. So this means my mash with 61 lb/bushel corn has more pounds of corn than if I used 56 lb/bushel corn, yet it has the same thickness so I know my pumps, agitators, exchangers and hoses can handle it.  We start with about 380 gallons of 90 degree F water, and use live steam inject to add about another 55 or 60 gallons worth of water getting it to high temp. With the grain we hit 500 gallons +/- 5 or 10 every time.

So for your 600 gallon recipe, as a 30 gallon beer, would be 20 bushels.

  • (20*75%) 15 bushels of corn times its test weight (56 is average, but you should test your grain) = 840 lbs
  • (20*21%) 4.2 bushels of rye (54 is average, again should test) = 227 lbs
  • (20*4%) .8 bushels of malt (38 is average) = 30.4 lbs of malt
  • Use about 528 gallons of water (less the appropriate amount of steam if using steam sparge)

These weights are for field grains, not flaked. I'd also recommend starting with a 30 gallon beer and see how your equipment runs it, and thicken/thin it out based off experience. We test all of our grains upon receiving, and update our mashbill in pounds to match the new test weight.

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On 8/31/2018 at 11:55 AM, Tom Lenerz said:

Georgeous - The American whiskey industry uses the term "beer gallons" to describe mash thickness for grain-in fermentation and distillation of things like corn, rye, wheat and malt. The reason for this, is most equipment and process can handle one level of mash thickness, and scaling up or down or comparing yields from plant to plant or recipe to recipe is much easier done this way. 

A beer gallon is the total volume of liquid per bushel. Big distilleries typically run a 28 to 35 gallon beer. We run a 30 gallon beer, and hit a starting gravity around 1.065.

So, for 500 gallons of finished mash, we start with 16 and 2/3rds bushels. This is important as bushels are a measure of volume, not weight, and we are working in volumes here. So this means my mash with 61 lb/bushel corn has more pounds of corn than if I used 56 lb/bushel corn, yet it has the same thickness so I know my pumps, agitators, exchangers and hoses can handle it.  We start with about 380 gallons of 90 degree F water, and use live steam inject to add about another 55 or 60 gallons worth of water getting it to high temp. With the grain we hit 500 gallons +/- 5 or 10 every time.

So for your 600 gallon recipe, as a 30 gallon beer, would be 20 bushels.

  • (20*75%) 15 bushels of corn times its test weight (56 is average, but you should test your grain) = 840 lbs
  • (20*21%) 4.2 bushels of rye (54 is average, again should test) = 227 lbs
  • (20*4%) .8 bushels of malt (38 is average) = 30.4 lbs of malt
  • Use about 528 gallons of water (less the appropriate amount of steam if using steam sparge)

These weights are for field grains, not flaked. I'd also recommend starting with a 30 gallon beer and see how your equipment runs it, and thicken/thin it out based off experience. We test all of our grains upon receiving, and update our mashbill in pounds to match the new test weight.

Tom, 

that is a lot for me to digest and learn. I really appreciate this explanation. i really need to test my system once finished hooking it up. Just need to finish glycol lines and electric then will see if i can make all this work as well as it does on my 50 gallon system 
So back to my original question is there a program that will do this for me? 

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