coop

Hey I am back. When I started this thread I was just finishing up my 4th fermentation tank and the first one was finishing up. So my comment about everything appearing normal at that time was correct. As you all know I have been very very busy figuring out what was wrong and checking out all the information you all gave me. This does take some time. You have to systematically eliminate possibilities before simply jumping off a bridge. My fermentation's were not near as clear after settling out. There became a sour taste to the liquid and grain. Instruments were checked for calibration, ok there. I listened to all that you all said and went on line to do more checking. There I found many articles on LAB. During WW2 and later on with the ethanol productions and this became a big problem and entire ethanol plants had to be shut down do to LAB infections. Yes some LAB is necessary and always their but not in excess. Under the right conditions it will bloom very quickly and disrupt fermentation to the point where great loses occur. Simple things can be done to control this. Things I was taking for granted as we were moving along quite well. The perfect storm you might say. I will not know for sure for a week to week and a half as the new requirements will have to have time to work. I will be emptying my last tank in to the still in a couple days, then we start again. Thanks again for all your help and I will keep you updated. Coop

Hey I am back. When I started this thread I was just finishing up my 4th fermentation tank and the first one was finishing up. So my comment about everything appearing normal at that time was correct. As you all know I have been very very busy figuring out what was wrong and checking out all the information you all gave me. This does take some time. You have to systematically eliminate possibilities before simply jumping off a bridge. My fermentation's were not near as clear after settling out. There became a sour taste to the liquid and grain. Instruments were checked for calibration, ok there. I listened to all that you all said and went on line to do more checking. There I found many articles on LAB. During WW2 and later on with the ethanol productions and this became a big problem and entire ethanol plants had to be shut down do to LAB infections. Yes some LAB is necessary and always their but not in excess. Under the right conditions it will bloom very quickly and disrupt fermentation to the point where great loses occur. Simple things can be done to control this. Things I was taking for granted as we were moving along quite well. The perfect storm you might say. I will not know for sure for a week to week and a half as the new requirements will have to have time to work. I will be emptying my last tank in to the still in a couple days, then we start again. Thanks again for all your help and I will keep you updated. Coop

Thank you all again. The Lodopen That Todd/Denver Distiller uses leaves no residual disinfectant so that should be here by Thursday then back at it Friday. Should be done running out last two tanks by then and get all the alcohol out I can. Coop

Well it is official, I have a LAB infection, will start this week on decontamination process. We are small so it will only take us one day. Todd, I ordered the Lodopen from 5 star this morning. I will be cleaning everything, hoses, gaskets, fittings inside and out. I will also do the mash kettle however I am wondering since I heat with direct steam injection into the wash and if LAB is coming in on the grain should not the wash be sterile after cooking? and is carried air born as we grind all our grains? If not would it do any good to sterilize the grinder also? Thanks to all of you for all your help in this matter, Coop

To answer your question "Is the tasting room another customer" YES, absoultly. What I have is in the bonded area clipboards at each product. This is where I keep a daily record of what and how much product was put into bottles along with what size, 750, 375 ect. Each time I remove from distillery inventory we mark what was taken out, to where is was taken, distributor or retail, how many and what date. As you know bi-monthly taxes. This inventory is added to the store in POS as receiving it. In our regular QB, a beginning inventory is applied. Each time we remove something from the bonded area it automatically deducts from other inventory, corks, capsules, bottles. Once a month we manually count every bottle of spirits to make sure count is correct. Sometimes we forget to mark a bottle down but this count is accurate to what is on hand. I never trust that the computer is right, so my manual count is what I pay taxes on. As to our tasting room being profitable, we take in from 50K to 60k a year so affording software is not a question. Coop

All help we get and give here is greatly appreciated and Todd you can tell me anything you want to. Todd where can I get what you are using? Lodophor? A refractometer is what I am using also. So with that, is why I never get to 0. I will check with my hydrometers to confirm complete conversions. Todd by "Stillage" do you mean spent grains? Or platform hight? coop

Will, we have never been able to get brix down to 0, starts at 15 then gets down to 5, head drops and tank cools down and settles out overnight. Fermentation room is separate from the rest of the distillery. Temperature controlled. Separate heating system. Right now it is at 84.5 degrees F. We use open fermenters at 734 gallons each although we only put 440 gallons of wash in them along with about 700# of grain. We check for acid content during mashing and at the end of fermentation. This checks out ok. May have some type of infection going on that was brought in with the grain. Coop

Hello Will, fresh yeast and it takes off within 2 to 3 hours, tank gets a little warmer from the reaction and by first thing in the morning I will have a 2 to 3 inch head on top. Fermentation works just like all the earlier ones. Fermentation takes about 4 to 6 days, brix goes from 15 down to 5. Coop

Yes it is a given, we run a bleach/water mix through everything once a month. But that does not mean something is on the grain. Maybe a preservative that is effecting it? Coop

Would "Fermaid-K from White Labs be what you are talking about?

After 3 years of operation something strange has happened. In the last month my yield of alcohol decreased by 50%. Using same formula, same yeast, same grain sources. I received a new supply of corn at the same time my yield dropped. Brix reading is the same after each mash run and after fermentation checked again brix reading is the same as usual but alcohol volume is down. Could their be something wrong with the new grain? Coop

I tried to call you this morning but only got the answering machine. Call me at 970-856-2600

Sonja, we use two programs at our distillery. Distillery use is Quick Books that tracks everything about the distillery. The store uses Quick Books POS, credit cards inventory of store pricing, scanner the works. I will give you more information tomorrow from work, have to eat now. Coop

$2,000.00 for what, ours cost nothing? I wonder what else is off. Coop

I also downloaded thanks, Coop

You need to really protect you and your license, both state and federal. I can promise you that each and ever day tons of minors are trying to purchase liquor on line. The lie about there age, have fake ID's, everything you can think of. Bottom line is if you sell to a minor you will pay dearly. Even if a person 21 or over orders it and are not home upon delivery and the neighbor kid gets it. You are in trouble. Some one some where will sue you. The $4 bucks is not paid by you, the customer pays for all shipping cost. The shipment is not covert at all. Any one can require a adult signature on anything they ship.

What I found out was that UPS and FedEx policy says no alcohol buttttttttttt what they really mean is they have a don't ask don't tell type of policy. All our UPS shippers here do not want to know what is in the package, they have told me this in person, do not tell me whats inside. So we remove all out side identifying labels, package real good to prevent breakage, mark it real good "Fragile" "Glass" and double tape box closed. All the liquor that is shipped in the USA goes through both companies.There is no other way. Not against any laws to ship through them. DO NOT TRY TO SHIP THROUGH REGULAR MAIL. That is against the law. Coop P.S. You must ship with the requirement "Adult Signature Required" to keep it out of the hands of minors

Thanks for clearing this up. When someone says liquor tank, to me it meant some kind of alcohol. Sorry for that. Coop

Not sure what you mean by Liquor tank? The steam its self is non explosive. However steam pressure is. You cannot inject steam into a vessel that builds up pressure in the tank. It must be vented.Now if you heat up Liquor? then the vapors become very explosive. I use direct steam injection for cooking my mash. The tank is well vented so no internal build up of pressure in the vessel. When you inject HOT steam into a cold liquid you get micro explosions due to HOT steam coming in contact with a cold liquid. These are not burning explosions but a reaction of hot meeting cold. As the temp increases in the liquid you are heating this becomes less and less because the liquid gets hotter and hotter. If using direct injection of steam into anything it will be diluted when the steam turns back into water. The "Liquor" no matter what the beginning proof is will be diluted a lot. My mash runs gain 30 gallons of water at the end of the run. If you use direct steam injection for anything you will be putting things into what ever you are heating from the boiler and the water source. These additives are not good. It will change the flavor and aroma of everything and not in a good way. Coop

Hey out their, I am going to the Oregon Spirits Tradeshow July 30 2011. I would like to meet with any of you that will be there. Please e mail me so that I look you up when there. coop2@sopris.net. Coop

Has any one ever mixed two different strains of Yeast? If so what were your results. Coop

I made my own 4 bottle blower set up. Coop

You must blow bottles out upside down. We have inserts which when the bottles are put on upside down reach up to the bottom of the inverted bottles, then blow them out through the upside down bottles. Coop

I will bring my camera to work tomorrow and take and try to post it. Coop

I built my own for our mash kettle, still had one already. 100 RPM is what it is rated at. Purchased one from Grainger with gear reduction and all for about $150.00 3/4hp. Made my own shaft with blades about $45.00. Need to specify one that sits vertical so that the bearing take the load right. Coop