MG Thermal Consulting

20 minutes ago, Southernhighlander said:

Sorry you couldn't come, Mike.  We hope to see you at next years event.

Paul.

Still trying to get out to N. AR to look at some property this spring, but housemate and I have been battling health issues- she was hospitalized 3 times in Feb, the last time she was being seen by FOUR Drs. from the CDC!  And they say it's just a FLU!!! She had IV's with 6 antibiotics and two different types of pneumonia.  They never tell you what you had, only what you don't have! Atlanta is a cesspool for mystery diseases, why we want out!

One size fits all>>>> Chiller+ reservoir+ process pump (chiller has its own pump). Chiller GPM always larger than process GPM.

For just still condenser cooling, an adjustable water valve (spring loaded ones or electronic) meters amount of water into condenser fro the chilled water main header and bypasses the remainder to temper the return water to the chiller. Or you can set a water valve downstream of the chiller to bypass some of the water/glycol return to temper return fluid before returning to chiller. Chiller pump flow without a reservoir should beat least double the flow required by still.  Since most distilleries are crashing and doing a still run the same day, chiller tank will be coldest at days start, then lose some ground before making the still run, which is ok, since still doesn't need as cold a cooling medium.  Similar to beer crashing, you can install a air/glycol subcooler to cool return glycol before returning back to cooling tank.  

Lot of this has effect on the budget, so some thought should be given to future plans on expansion.

That's why I like to offer the glycol coolers to customers in the North, I have guys in ME, VT and CT not even turning the chiller on from NOV-MAR.

For Thatch's case, probably save 3-5 HP/hr every day all winter.

Welcome!

I have clients using chillers around San Diego and do not have glycol in their systems.

The purposes for glycol are twofold- to keep the process fluid from freezing below ambient temps below 0F and to sanitize if the process fluid is open to the atmosphere (reservoir tank) to reduce organisms (glycol mixture must be above 30%). If you don't go below freezing then you can treat water with chemicals or use ozone treatment (which is popular in Cali. I recommend Ozone Systems which are made in CA. 

I have larger systems that use glycol and can do so except for the worry of a leak (and a messy cleanup).

If you are cooling mash, you will need an auxiliary tank, if only the still condenser, I have a couple chiller types that have integral tanks and are non-atmospheric that you can use city water.

Email if you need specs, descriptions, or referrals.

Mike Gronski, MG Thermal

770-995-4066

You could run water through a dry cooler as well.

I use them with chillers as winter operation for glycol cooling...saves on the power of running the chiller up North, but you could use them to take out heat of water as well.

Good Luck out there, Paul! 

Sorry to miss you, had to cancel trying to get there this year.

M

The operating cost of the chiller is so much KWh x cents per KWh.

The operating cost of the water is the cost of water plus sewage cost.  

Simple for you if you're on a farm with well, not so much on city water where costs keep rising for both water and sewage (I pay more for sewage than water- overstressed sewage plants, etc.)

If you get a chiller with a lease, it usually pays for itself.

A 2 HP chiller should do it, $7,000 or less. 230/1/60.

I have a used 3 HP for less but it's 460/3/60.

If you need to chill mash, then you should add a chilled water reservoir so you don't overheat.  Most guys use a tote, piping it between process and chiller return.

Mike

Hey, Good Luck.

Funny, I just shipped a chiller to Highlands Distillery in Chicago.

There are some names that don't get old, ha.

1 ton (of refrigeration) = 12,000 Btu/hr

50 HP chiller roughly gives you 50 tons of refrigeration at 50F supply water temperature.

Colder supply temperatures derate the performance such that 25F supply glycol/water roughly gives you only 1/2 the tons it would at 50F.

G,

How are you keeping the CLT cold? A recirculating chiller?

Silk,

Sounds about right for the total load.

Do you have a reservoir tank? That cuts the chiller size down in proportion to the amount of chilled water you precool. 

Precooling the tank with the chiller running dedicated to the mash cooling until complete will allow recovery so the chiller can be used for the still.

2K, 

Let me know if you need to add on your chiller system for the upgrade!

I've added a boiler line as well.

Welcome, BC.

If you have any questions on cooling systems when you ramp up, let me know!

I have an great air glycol cooler to reduce your chiller electric cost for the whole winter- customer in CT uses his from Nov to Mar without the chiller running- saves cost of 10 HP chiller all winter.  

You are in a perfect place for it, me being an ex-Buffalonian!

I will offering a filtering option soon as well, developed by a brewery/distillery consultant- let me know if you want me to send you info.

Scott,

Just curious, how are you going to chill your whiskey mash- with a separate heat exchanger?

Mike

Good luck, P29.

I am taking on a new line of Boilers out of Nashville that will start up their boilers with factory techs, and are used to breweries and distilleries.

What they don't do is installs because of local coding. This is what will trip you up as you know.

Maybe the boiler manufacturer you have selected can offer suggestions?

Hi, from Hamburg previously- I supplied chillers to a couple of the BFLO distilleries.  Glad to see more in my old stomping grounds!

Greetings and if you need any cooling assistance, give me a shout!

(my son recently moved to Denver and is loving the outdoor activities and wilderness!)

Yep and the chiller, cold water reservoir and pumps are being plumbed next week. 

Same size as my photo but chiller is rooftop with reservoir, pumps and pump/chiller controls indoors.

Factory sending chiller start-up tech early January from TN.

Welcome, I bet you have fun getting that mash crashed in the summer! You have a heat exchanger for it?

Hey Bflo! Are you in NY or one of the Bflos out West? One of those setups was sold by Trident to a Distiller in Pittsburgh if you want to see it in action? I supplied the chiller for that one too.

Per Pete's post, you still need the chiller system for cooling mash. 

If you can't get the mash done fast enough, it will become a choke point for production.

I have sold many customers of Trident their chillers. Contact me if you need a price, new or recon available.

That is more common technique when cooling with an external exchanger, but it depends on how much surface area you have in the fermenter jacket, if you don't have it all the way around, it's problematic.