Glenlyon

Another under utilized source of capital if you are short is business equipment leasing. The interest can be higher, but not always and you get to deduct the entire cost as a business expense. Which can be very helpful the first few years. As well, once the lease has expired you can usually make a small payment and then own the gear outright. We've used this technique very effectively with several enterprises.

Once you are up and running, get the accountant to value the business. It will cost you about $10k, but you get defensible documentation and valuation.

Unless you are starting rather large operation with a really big capital investment, and you've had previous corporate experience handling investors - I recommend staying away from investors. They can be fickle and expensive to keep and can quickly derail your vision with their own. Instead, if you are small - go to the bank. It will be harder to talk them into giving you money, but the terms and conditions are much clearer and easier to meet and exceed at. Best yet, self capitalize and stay out of debt altogether. You'll quickly discover reaching a profitable position will be much easier to achieve and best of all, you won't have to give the profits away once you start earning them.

Anyone of the aforementioned instrument supply suggestions will likely yield a good thermometer. However, a fellow member was gracious enough to inform me of www.thermoworks.com so you may want to give them a try. A quick forum search would also likely revealed the same information without the wait.

Thanks Tim. We used 1" plastic water pipe.

There is a commercial distillery here in BC who created a canned product called 'Mike's Hard Lemonade'. I guess you could call that a cocktail in a can! So, assuming one has the correct licensing, I would expect that there would be a good market for well developed canned cocktails. BTW, Mike's Hard Lemonade has made the distillery hundreds of millions of dollars, because, you know: 'It's An Excellent Source of Vodka!' (Their positioning line.)

We installed a closed loop system that can be either water or glycol. Right now we're using water. The water is cooled by sending it through a 400' coil which lives at the bottom of a pond about the size of a swimming pool. In the summer when its warm, we can send the hot condenser water directly to the pond heat exchanger/coil. In the winter, we can re-direct the hot water into the radiant floor heating system to warm the tasting room. We run three small stills and a wort chiller this way and so far so good.

Not Eastern Canada, but these people will sell you the hydrometers and then ship them directly to the feds for certification. http://ecom.bosagrape.com/home.php?cat=1221 Turnaround is about 4-6 weeks.

You may find it challenging to install a oil tank these days. Out here on the coast, oil tanks are a big liability and there have been several cases of landowners having to pay big time for even small leaks. The bio/veg-oil sounds like a superior strategy, even with increased maintenance requirements. Also, the bio-oil may also offer some interesting marketing opportunities to the environmentally minded.

Do you use a machine to automatically T-top cork the bottles? If so, which one? They seem to be hard to find.

I would be cautious around the idea that a small/micro business needs to buy from small/micro business to be authentic. That suggests that all big companies are inherently what? What is under suspicion? I own a tiny media company and one day to my complete surprise, I got a call out of the blue from one of the province’s biggest companies and they wanted to hire me. I couldn't believe it and within days I was rejoicing over the big contract and the very creative work I was going to do. I wound up working with them for four fantastic years. I’ve had a relationship with another large company and have provided services to them for over 20 years. Working with these and other companies, I’ve learned just because a company is big doesn't mean they don’t work hard to create a great product. That's why they are big. Joe is bigger than me - he makes GNS. If I were operating in the states, I might buy some from him. However, there’s always someone bigger and perhaps one day, Joe needs to turn to them to meet demand. Again, it’s all about the business environment one operates in. Good for Joe’s sales team if he can’t meet demand! The consumer has spoken! Don’t forget the big players make great spirits and they service a vast market. Meanwhile, most small guys are thinking only state/province wide or citywide. I think by default, small players, craft players if you will, will buy from smaller companies - mostly because they are looking for something special. Stills, barrels, that special farmer’s super duper barley - relationships. Last night I went on an alcohol crawl to check out the local competition. Each place we went to had their own vibe. One place was pretty low budget, hand made, great product, hipster crowd. The next, was polished wood with trendy gray walls and a window into the big sexy brew room. It had a very yuppie 30+ crowd. Much more expensive. Underaged gin. The final one we hit was a large farm operation that produces a large amount of product for a provincial market. Comfy, wood fired pizzas, lots if locals just hanging out, great product. Lots of room for kids. So each place makes a different product to attract the customers they need and want. Large or small, its up to the individual micro business’s marketing genius to find the audience that best suits the business and how it wants to fit in the community, both business and consumer. All that being said, if I were young and getting into this business today, I would buy a shitload of GNS create whatever product I could dream up and export the lot to Taiwan. I have once met a man who does this and he is filthy rich.

In our area, we're not allowed to use GNS if we have the craft license, so we have to make everything onsite. That's ok for a small guy like me, who caters to the local market, which in itself is very small. Because we live outside the Lower Mainland (Vancouver) we can get away with this low key approach. That's why I call myself 'artisan' rather than craft. However, if I wanted to start a distillery in Vancouver or any of the surrounding municipalities, it would be pretty much impossible to operate with a simple craft designation. If you wanted to open in Vancouver for example, the equipment and start-up costs would be the least of your worries. Instead you would be languishing under a TON of oppressive property taxes and rents. It can cost anywhere from $250K to $1M a year just for rent and property taxes. There is no way you could produce enough product (well) to meet the need to pay those kinds of fees. So I would use GNS without hesitation and most of the existing distilleries do so. So, I don't think it's a great idea to say one approch is better than another. It really boils down to the kind of business environment you operate in.

295 euros per bottle. Wow, that's $438 per bottle Canadian! Break out those tulip bulbs!

Here is a follow up story on craft beer. The video that is embedded in the story is quite insightful visa vie the discussion around craft and why one may or may not choose to open a new venture. Although it does focus on beer, I feel many of the points can be applied to the distilling biz as well. http://www.cbc.ca/news/business/beer-craft-brewing-1.4455032

Awesome! Thank you.

Could you be a bit more specific about the vendors and the actual thermometers?

Any advice on sourcing, choosing and acquiring quality certifiable thermometers? My normal source has quit carrying them and I need a replacement PDQ. Thanks!

I don't. I just shrug and offer to add an extra $20 for the G.F. version.

You can die from any number reasons, accident, bee stings, peanuts, wheat, stupidity. If you are truly celiac, then I would have lots of sympathy, but the vast, vast majority of G.F. claimants I've dealt with are into the fad of it not the medical reality. In essence they have hijacked the concept from real sufferers. Both in my past food life and my current booze life I've had to put up with a shitload of this kind of whining. Fundamentally, distillates are inherently G.F. and if you don't want the wheat based spirit - choose corn/honey/fruit. No big deal.

I have had the 'Gluten Free' argument many, many times as I've patiently explained how the process works. I can not believe the resistance to facts. I've pretty much thrown in the towel on trying to change minds. Instead, I tell people that our products are for real foodies, not wannabes. If they want G.F. crap, feel free to spend eight bucks on a shitty muffin. I have no respect for the G.F. concept.

A most spirited Christmas to all!

My sincere apologies for over over simplifying your problems, but your post was a bit vague off the top. After reading your response, clearly you want to move to BC. The regulations we toil under are trivial in comparison to the US system.

I read this post with interest as I'm installing a closed circuit cooling system, wherein the cooling water is sent out of the hot condenser through several hundred feet of curly tube located at the bottom of a large pond to cool before coming back through the system. I've since modified it to take a extra trip through the floor of the tasting room to provide radiant heat, but that's another story. Anyway, I posed the question about keeping the water clean to my friend, a learned doctor and this is what he said... The cooling water does not need to be sterile. That said, you don’t want a lot of bacteria growing in there because of the “yuk factor”. But bacteria can only grow where there is nutrients. If you put 1 gram of nutrient in a cubic meter of water, it can’t grow more than a gram of bacteria. So the #1 principle is that the cooling water should be clean when you put it in, and the system itself should be clean. I suggest: 1) fill the system with a TSP/bleach solution. Run the circulating pump for ½ hour. This is to clean out any manufacturing residues from the system 2) rinse with tap water 3) fill with RO water (which is sterile and nutrient free). You need to have some documented routine to re-sanitize the cooling system as needed or on some kind of schedule. ? Bi-monthly ? Alternatives could include 1) repeat of above, but with a “wine equipment sanitizer” 2) UV treatment on occasion... like an hour a week. 3) Monitor bacteria growth by plating out cooling water. We will be set up for yeast incubation so we can do bacteria as well. Don’t worry about the stainless steel + bleach paranoia. You wouldn’t want to store bleach solution in a stainless container. But rinsing stainless with a standard sanitizing solution will do no harm at all. Bleach in solution is extremely reactive…. so much so that it is gone in 24 hours.

Its been a while since I've read Mash's post, but if memory serves, taxes largely bit him on the ass. So, although you haven't described your peril in detail, let's assume for this conversation, taxes are the root of the problem to start. Taxes in alcohol are well, particularly taxing. There are a lot of details to consider and I'm talking about the CND system, I know the US system with of of it's attendant regulations can be even worse. So, right off the top, to turn your operation around you need to look at your tax situation and how can you manage it or eliminate it. Don't forget you are collecting all kinds of taxes: excise taxes, sales taxes, property taxes, sources deductions for employees, income tax, etc. The first thing you need to wrap you mind around is that you DON'T OWN THE TAX. Mr Trump (or Mr Trudeau for us Canadians) does. So any taxes collected need to be skimmed off at the source and paid on the spot. Get ahead of this and your life will simplify in a heartbeat. I know all of this because I have been dogged by taxes my whole business life and have paid some godawful bills to catch up. I'm old now and not near as rich as I used to be, but much wiser and happier. Taxes are a serious drag, but are recoverable (the tax department will work with you of you can present a plausible plan to recover) and once you've figured that out, like all business owners everywhere, the next thing you need to come to terms with is debt. How much do you have and what kind is it? Did you borrow a lot to start up? Or, is trade debt that's built up over time? Again, debt is something you can recover from. Long term debt is more difficult, but predicable. Short term trade debt builds because foolish business schools and accountants will tell you to buy on terms and then stretch the terms to maximize interest. That's great if you have loads of cash, but does NOT work for most small businesses, because you are probably under capitalized and don't have the cash in the bank to begin with. A far, far better strategy is pay as you go. Forget trade debt if you can, I can't stress this enough. Pay as you go. You'll sleep much better a night, and you'll get better deals and service from suppliers. Every day, whether they like it or not, all business owner always wake up facing three questions. Should I borrow money? should I sell assets? or, should I sell more product? Only the third option will steer your ship of state in the right direction. So you have to ask yourself - am I selling enough product at the right price? Answer this question and you will be able to recover from debt and taxes. Throwing in the towel is easy. But nobody said the liquor business was easy. Its a tough, constantly demanding business where your reputation matters and where the government has an opinion on your every move. You've got to be savvy to survive. Consider the posts that @microshiner have been posting about brand placement and value propositions. Ask yourself, are you selling to the right market for your needs? Do you have a business plan? If not write one. It will help to guide your decisions and its never too late. Writing things down can make them seem less intimidating and more manageable.

Hiya MS, you might be interested in this Canadian perspective on 'peak beer' ( http://www.cbc.ca/news/business/beer-craftbeer-toolshed-labatt-molson-draught-sleeman-sapporo-abinbev-1.4439295 )which, generally bolsters your point of view. I think 'craft' as known in the beer world is pretty big. Even small breweries can cost millions to start and often the 'craft' of the original intent is further crafted to make sure the product can support a hefty overhead consistently. There are lots of mid-sized distilleries that would also fall into that category and if they have built a strong local market and they can keep the product flowing, they are excellent businessmen and probably understand the market in ways I sure don't. As, I've mentioned in the past, I live in a land awash with craft booze of every kind and so I view the role of the "micro-distillery" as different than trying to service a mid-mass market using the craft term. Instead, I prefer the term 'artisan', suggesting a more 'hands on, locally sourced' approach. I think this gives the very small distiller a fighting chance on the local level, but offers little long term growth potential. Call that sustainable!