kleclerc77

On 3/16/2021 at 6:32 PM, adamOVD said:

Out of curriosity, when running that set up, do you start by equalizing the first column, before sending vapor to the second column, and then also equalizing it at well, or do you do it another way?

Yes. I have the deph pretty much wide open on the first column, and when every plate is bubbling away happily I'll start to slowly dial back the deph until vapor can get by into the next column. I then do the same thing with the second column into the condenser. I think our biggest issue with maintaining 190 proof/equilibrium between columns is inconsistent steam pressure. It doesn't make too much of a difference with everything else, it's just touchy here and there, but with a process as finnicky as vodka distillation, the inconsistencies in steam pressure make it tough. Luckily, I mostly make a lot of double pot distilled whiskey! 

@dmacnz Just checking back in here... I found that the best recalibration I could do was selecting the "factory adjustment" tab under "adjustments". My water calibration wasn't doing the trick, I must have had bad technique or was doing something wrong. Selecting the factory adjustment now has it back to agreeing with our approved hydrometers and thermometers. 

The general consensus seems to be you'll need 18-20 theoretical plates to achieve 190+. We have 18 theoretical (two side by side eight plate columns both topped with dephlegmators) and I can achieve 190+ but not for the whole run. I think you'll have trouble achieving 190+ with your setup without making up for your lack of plates with some packing.

You can't use that for your final proof for a reason. Ours also tends to be about one proof degree off of our readings when using approved hydrometers and thermometers - especially when the temperature of the spirit is ~5F off of 60F either way. The DMA's temp correction is pretty good, but not perfect. I have, however, done the same thing, and noticed a couple products that are over 10 proof degrees off. That was clearly a proofing error on the side of the distillery. 

On 12/30/2020 at 3:19 PM, DeerHunter said:

Buffalo Molasses: 1830 Perry Rd North Java NY 14113

(716)572-7369

Buffalomolasses.com

They only carry blackstrap /: 

23 hours ago, SlickFloss said:

You buy from pat at wt?

Sure do! They've been wicked helpful in developing our mash protocol. Their enzymes are simple and effective with our raw, coarse ground grains. Plus there's something comforting in talking yeast physiology with someone with a heavy southern twang. I can't recommend them enough.

I have seen the introduction of 50MLs to the lineup literally make a head distiller get up and quit. Very dramatic, lol. That being said, I see 50 ML sample packs fly off the shelves during the holidays. The rest of the year, not so much. You can also advertise the fact that they can be brought on an airplane, being under 3 oz.

It sounds like your enzymes aren't being used to their maximum potential. Wheat gel temp is in the 160F range, you shouldn't need to cook it to death to get good conversion. Our enzyme supplier (also a large distillery) suggests not cooking above a grain's required gel temp for both flavor and efficiency reasons. I can see a lot of dough balls / clumping happening if you add your wheat to a 185 degree mash. I would aim to not denature your Alpha enzymes (or get a more robust one), and pitch the wheat down in the 160-170F range. we do that with our raw wheat and get a full conversion.

4 hours ago, SlickFloss said:

If you're not using caustic and acid how do you know you're killing microbes?

Power washers- do you guys struggle with hard water scales issues at all in your cookers and do you find the power washer to remove those films?

 

 

 

 

We've learned to embrace the local microbiome here. Out of everything, that's something that no other distillery will be able to replicate. I like the way our ferments end dry and sour, and we lose that nice sourness in the finished ferment when we were nuking the tanks with caustic and/or P3. If you strike everything just right and get your ferment going nice and quickly, you shouldn't have to worry about microbial competition for sugar right off the bat. I make sure to get all of the little nooks and crannies - temp probe sockets, etc, when cleaning. Occasionally I'll let hot water and caustic sit in the exit port of our mash tun - that seems to be the only place I can't quite reach with anything else and will develop some bad funk. 

This power washer gets the job done. We tried a less powerful one before that wasn't cutting it, but the 2300 PSI model does the trick. I will let some hot water sit in the bottom beforehand so the steam softens everything up a bit first.

2 hours ago, Golden Beaver Distillery said:

We use our pressure Ryobi washer everyday, cuts down on chem use, too.  

Right! I barely use caustic at all anymore. I love the fact that I have almost completely eliminated its use here. The less gnarly chemicals, the better. 

We were having a similar issue here, although no internal coil. An aggressive chemical clean (caustic) wasn't cutting it. We ended up buying a little power washer - one that you plug in as opposed to an intense gas powered one so you don't damage the inside of the mash tun at all. It works like a charm. It is a Ryobi 2300 PSI model. 

The best way to get a stuck ferment going again is to make a big starter. Mix up your yeast and add a sizeable amount of mash to it, or add it to ~50 gallons of mash even, til it's churning away nicely, then add that to your stuck ferment. Our mashing procedures are very different, but if it works for the most part then I'm not sure why some are getting stuck and some aren't. Big differences are we add our corn before the cook up as opposed to adding it at 190, cook our rye in more the 160-170 range, barley at 145, and our gluco goes in at the very end right before the yeast.

are they stuck or are they just finishing more quickly?

We use coarsely ground corn and rye here and get great conversion with 45 minute temp rests. For the most part, our ratios match up. Though it is tough to say when we're not using the same brand of enzymes. My one thought is that you may want to contact your enzyme supplier about how to maximize their efficiency. We use a high temp alpha at 2ml per gallon / final mash volume, added after the first 25% of grain is added. It works like a charm in the 170-190F range. We then pitch our gluco amylase as we start to fill the fermenter, right before we pitch our yeast. Another question, which has resulted in lower yields for some folks: how low are you collecting your into stripping run? 

I've had lots of luck doing everything unmalted but the barley. We use a high temp Alpha Amylase enzyme for the cook up, which helps with viscosity issues as well as starch conversion. I still pitch and rest the malted barley on the way down at around 145 to utilize other enzymes present in the barley. You could accomplish conversion with only the malted barley if you nail your temps, but I like the consistency of the mash and ease of using an exogenous enzyme. I am very happy with our final product using unmalted rye and corn, but malted barley.

Adirondack has been supplying us with some of the nicest barrels I've ever gotten to work with. 36-42 month air seasoned oak, and extreme attention to detail. 

https://www.adirondackbarrelcooperage.com/ 

3 hours ago, JustAndy said:

I can't see the logic for having a mash tun 2x the fermenter

The production schedule we're on now has me mashing twice a day to fill two fermenters, so for our situation an oversized mash tun would be sweet. Mash twice and clean the still Wednesday, polish Thursday and Friday, strip Monday and Tuesday, and repeat. Everyone's setups are so different it's hard to generalize about equipment needs

Also, I love the hot takes @Silk City Distillers ! We are collaborating with a brewery to lauter some single malt wash for us in the coming year because of the horror stories of on-grain single malts. Have you considered doing that with the brewery next door? My biggest fear would be the (in)ability to get all the malt our of the fermenter after a nice long ferment.

I've heard the same high praise about UK malts. Does it justify the price difference? 

Oh yeah nah we do all grain in stuff here. No lautering capability so no malt whiskies for us at the moment.

I like our 1:1 mash tun to fermenter size. Keeps things simple. That being said, it would be pretty badass to have that ratio be 2:1 so you could fill both fermenters with one mash. I don't see any advantage in having a mash tun that won't fill at least one fermenter.

Dang I just got my first ever cheesey ferment. The weird part is, only one of the two ferments I did got cheesey. So it doesn't seem like the grain is to blame. Did you ever come to any conclusions on this @bconley?

I'd recommend using a set of rolling cantilever stairs vs. a ladder.

Also, the snap 50 isn't always dead on, which is the reason they're not approved by the ttb for final gauging. Especially with this heat, the temp correction isn't always right. My snap seems to be off in that range during the summer when the temp of the spirits is high. Get yourself some ttb approved lab grade hydrometers and a thermometer to temp correct for yourself. These hydrometers have small ranges say 75-95 proof, 80 to 100 proof, and so on. 

The idea of any contaminants in the final product - whether it be cardboard/dust/bottle production stuff, after spending years carefully crafting a spirit, is enough reason for us to go with a professional rig. @MichaelAtTCW is always wicked helpful with questions/customer support. We'll be placing an order soon.

Damn this bottle came with a better engineer's drawing than our still did 😂😂😂

The thing that caught my eye was the temp control on the water going IN to the deph. Wouldn't the temp of the water OUT of the deph be the better place to control it? The temp of the water coming out will be indicative of the temp being held in the deph, where water temp going in can/will fluctuate because it's city water.