grehorst

If you're reading this via email it is because the new topic email notification that was previously broken has been repaired. That being said, it is a "NEW" message notification, if you don't manually check the forums site periodically you will miss out on follow-up and responses. Happy distilling! Your Admin.

I would love to call whoever has our permit- the TTB used to assign a representative to a distillery, we had one from the day we were issued our first permit. I learned from a TTB rep at the ADI conference that this is no longer the case and that it can land on anyones desk.

Just the fact that you got through to someone amazes me Chuck! I've been calling about the status of my permit modifications and no one has called back. (see my rant from yesterday in this same forum). Guy

Sent in changes to our fed permit 4 months ago. Now I need to make more changes but still don't have the last set approved and returned. Anyone else done a permit change lately? How long did it take? I have called 3 different people and left a message at the general number, no one has gotten back to me yet. Last time this happened- that was a 5 month span, I called our congressman who promptly contacted the TTB on our behalf. Changes were approved and the permit returned to us the next day.

Correct Charles- I get sloppy when typing through anger.

Having experienced this myself numerous times, I can only say that you're at their mercy. We tried using the word Apertif and were shut down- implies health benefit. Our absinthe labels took a year to get approved because of SO MANY stupid little issues that I'm not sure I remember them all. "can't have the word absinthe on a line all by itself", "can't use a year on the label without another modifying word on the same line or it infers a vintage" Suffice it to say we are the only absinthe on the market that had to state "Thujone Free" on the label despite all absinthe on the market being thujone free. I'm usually a fighter, but they have demonstrated again and again that there is no consistent logic applied to the label review. I have fought and fought and there is no logical path with them on these issues, there seems to be no recourse at all. My advice is to move past it and get your product out anyway you can, the omission or addition of a word will likely not have an effect on sales.

Welcome Jamie, I'm not sure if we've previously met I'm Guy from Great Lakes Distillery in Milwaukee. Have enjoyed your products on my many visits to your area. Be sure to check into WI regs carefully- if you are selling spirits other than those you produce yourself at Moosejaw the state may not want to give you a distillers permit. Message me if you want more info. If you get to Milwaukee, stop in and say hi! Guy

Yes, although not explicit in their trademark color certainly plays in their concerns. In our negotiations they were very concerned that my orange wax was too close to red. Their trademark also specifically states whisky yet they pursue and have won cases against makers of other spirits.

Not sure what fun you are talking about but, thanks for the link, glad to see he's been stopped. As for the "censorship" issue, this is an open public forum but that doesn't mean anyone has a right to post whatever they want. Early on with this situation there was a lot of one sided information and the accused was threatening many people on these forums. Posts were removed until it was determined through law enforcement that the accusations were legit. Since I am pretty much the lone administrator as well as trying to run a distillery I don't always have time to verify facts in every post nor every situation that may arise. When something posted is accusatory the ADI runs a certain liability and it is my job -oh, I do this for free so guess it's not a job but an assumed responsibility to offer a certain level of protection. If what I'm doing is not up to your standards feel free to move on.

We sprinklered a 14,000 sq ft building for about $50k. I think that included about 100 ft of lateral from the street.

-$2,500 Sponsor a speaker -$2,500 Sponsor of "The Taste of Germany" and other European whiskies. -$2,500 Sponsor of "The Taste of "Australia" Three Australian Distiller's program. -$5,000 Sponsor the Sunday night reception. -$10,000 Sponsor the ADI "VIP" social event. • All sponsors receive full conference passes (2 people) • Sponsors logs will appear of the conference program and on the ADI website. • Sponsors are invited to a the "VIP" social on Sunday Afternoon Bill Owens/President/American Distilling Institute Questions:email bill@distilling.com or call me at 510-886-7418 AM is best.

FYI- Looks like a very handy guide to what you may be doing wrong! http://www.ttb.gov/spirits/common_compliance_tax_issues-during-audits-ds.shtml

Info is available- follow banners at the top of the forum.

Bill would like photos of your distillery Christmas tree's for the newsletter- send them to bill@distilling.com

Posted at the request of Bill Owens... The distillery has undergone significant capital improvements on the 28 acre site in the last few years. Notably, there are seven aging warehouses on the site with a total capacity of about 140,000 barrels (which could be leased out to other distilleries to generate revenue), as well as four bulk storage warehouses with a total of about 60,000 sq. ft. The facility is tourism friendly (another source of immediate cash flow) and has a clean environmental record. All it needs is some basic distilling equipment to be a great operation. Of course, there is much enthusiastic support in the Owensboro community for this historic facility, to include a strong interest in providing economic incentives to see it restored to its highest value. The owner is asking only $7.5mm for the Plant Property & Equipment. Historic Bourbon trademarks associated with the Distillery may also be available, along with aged Bourbon stocks, that could be used for the immediate launch of brand(s). I’ve attached a ‘virtual tour’ containing info and recent photos of the facility. Should you or anyone you know be interested in exploring this further, I’d be happy to arrange for a facility tour and/or to get additional information. Thank you. Best regards, Richard Wolf 502.320.6419 (Note from Admin- The power point was not in the message I was sent. I will post it as well as soon as I get it.)

I am told all info should be available next week! I will post it as soon as it comes my way...

Update- Appeal begins... http://www.washingtonpost.com/business/court-steps-into-sticky-issue-can-makers-mark-bourbon-stop-others-from-using-red-wax-seal/2011/12/01/gIQA2HE2GO_story.html

A lot of people did. Of course a lot of people disliked it too. They have promised me it will be fixed in a soon to be released update...

http://adiforums.com/index.php?showtopic=2107

Over two years later now and finally Jim think's I'm "WORLD CLASS" too. So, what does he do? get breweries and distilleries to send him free stuff and sell it at flea markets?

Don't know about pumpkin vodka but we've been doing this for the last 4 years- http://www.greatlakesdistillery.com/pumpkin.htm It's closer to a whiskey, makes an awesome Old fashioned. Did many a hot toddy with it when I had a cold a few weeks ago- I'd swear it cured me but that would violate my agreement with the TTB .

Just read an article in the Wall St. Journal about a bill before congress that would allow crowd sourcing funds for up to $1 Million without the usual SEC issues. Investors could invest no more than 10% of their annual income. Could make opening a distillery easier... I believe the article said it may get stalled in the senate.

Arthur, Do you really wish to give your potential customers a requirement for additional permits?? I've been through the process, invested the time and money, worked to get state laws changed and been doing this for a while so don't write me off when I say this; the requirement for a DSP permit is to ensure a system of collecting EXCISE TAX. Bars purchase their alcohol from a distributor. The tax is priced into the alcohol they buy. What they do with it after that point should not be of any concern to a DSP unless they are bottling it and selling it off their own premise. When it's on premise and sold in a glass this is called a cocktail, doesn't matter what the ingredients are, how long it's been sitting around, or whether it's in a shot glass or 5 gallon carboy. Seriously, this will NOT effect YOUR business. In my state bars have been infusing for years. I can tell you it doesn't harm us one bit. A little advice. Focus on getting laws changed to allow you to sell and pour in YOUR facility, don't worry about how bars are using it when they have bought and paid for it. Don't even mention bars infusing as it will take away from the message of what you really need to say- that laws forbidding sales from your tasting room need to change to allow sampling and sales on the spot. Good luck, Guy

There are filters you can put on the steam line being directly injected that render this type of operation safe. We were required to have them and as I recall they are pricey.

Thanks all, I built a new gin forum, moved all 3 of the current topics into it and deleted the old one. See if that works.