Threshold for Needing a Boiler vs. Direct Fire Gas/Electric

[MaggiesFarm]

I was put under the impression by pretty well-known consultant in the industry that the cutoff point for where you can no longer use a direct-fired steam bath is around 250-300L still. In speaking with another consultant regarding an actual purchase of equipment, I was told that they've used electrical heating elements on stills with a steam bath up to 1000L. Someone else had basically backed up this statement by saying they've seen electrical elements used on larger stills as well.

I'm looking to avoid the need for a boiler not only for cost reasons, but also for local zoning issues. Just wondering what the school of thought was amongst everyone else. Pros are obviously the initial cost savings, but what are the cons? Longer run-up times? Electrical requirements? Increased utility costs?

Thanks.

[Absinthe Pete]

I've built lots and lots of stills. I have no doubt that if you're trying to steam heat with direct heating elements 1000 Liters or more that you will NOT save money. By the time you get it plumbed, buy the elements (which are very expensive), and run electrical you'll be out a ton of money. You can buy used steam boiler for not much money, just look around.

[MaggiesFarm]

I've built lots and lots of stills. I have no doubt that if you're trying to steam heat with direct heating elements 1000 Liters or more that you will NOT save money. By the time you get it plumbed, buy the elements (which are very expensive), and run electrical you'll be out a ton of money. You can buy used steam boiler for not much money, just look around.

Not trying to heat even close 1000L. I was just told it's been done. Looking at 400L max. From some quotes I've seen, the elements are still a lot less than the cost of a boiler, even a used one. I guess a big drawback is needing an element per still or mash tun, as opposed to a boiler running everything. Though, with seperate elements, you can at least run everything at the same time.

[Jedd Haas]

I've been thinking about a 100 gallon electric still (378 liter). It would have 4x 5.5kW elements, and need a 100 amp circuit. That's about as big as I'd like to go for electric.

[Mick H]

One thing you should keep in mind. You will be spending a lot of hours with your equipment in the months and years to come. Just because one system gets you across the finish line does not mean it is the best way to go. Using a easier and affordable system 2, 3 4 or 5 more hours a day might not make sense over the long haul.

Mick H.

[coop]

I think the one thing you should be asking yourself is how many of the major distilleries and the larger micro distilleries in the US use anything but steam. For sure not because they think it is better, just cheaper in the long run. Heat is Heat, Coop

[MaggiesFarm]

Good points. Thanks.

[bluestar]

We are doing a 50 gallon with electric elements and a 1 hour heat up from cold. That requires 40kW of 240v or 480v power. That is a lot of power! If you have gas, a gas steam boiler would be far more efficient and cheaper to operate in the long run, even at this size. And if you don't have that kind of power, you could spend as much bringing in 3 phase higher voltage as you would spend on the boiler. Jedd's solution is possible, since you don't need the full power to run the still, just to bring up to initial temperature. On the other hand, 20KW would take 2 hours to bring to temperature from cold for 50 gallon, maybe 3-4 hours for 100 gallon. I assume 40-50 gallons of bath water in addition to the pot contents.

By the way, our still and many of the electric element stills are actually not steam heated, they are bain maries, or water bath heated. There are some definite advantages, including the ability to use the pot for things other than distilling, like mashing or heat compounding at prolonged controlled temperatures below boiling.